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Maybe We Need More 'Leaders'

Ok, I'm not a big hockey fan, but from what I can surmise, some of you are. Get a load of this clip of Gary Roberts, who is 41 years old mind you, fighting some young whipper snapper that I've never heard of. It's an impressive display of combat skills, but the true comedy comes from the play-by-play announcer exalting Roberts' leadership qualities near the end of the clip.


'That's leadership'. Love it.

Funny how fighiting in hockey is construed as showing leadership, yet people went bananas over the NBA brawl at The Palace in Detroit several years ago.  

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well
didn't players go up into the stands at that NBA game? Its quite a bit different I think. Roberts was standing up for his teammate, just like a pitcher will throw at someone to retaliate for an earlier incident.

If you want to watch lots of leadership there's always Hockey Fights which is always good for timewasting.

Also The Pens Blog is a fantastic completely NSFW and inappropriate Penguins blog that is always good for some laughs.

by schnifin on Dec 19, 2007 4:01 PM EST reply actions  

What aboutMy 2 cents
What about the reaction to the "brawl" last year between the Nuggets and the Knicks where Carmelo "No Snitches" Anthony sucker punch a knick player. I seem to remember s storm of "NBA = thugs" accusations afterwards, where as the NHL gets more of a pass.

That being said, I think the reason for a lack of outrage is more do to the fact that far fewer people care about hockey and it is not easily accessible for the casual fan. News shows and talking heads gloss over it because people tend to tune it out and/or change the channel.

A far as needing this type of leadership, could you imagine the prison sentence Harrison would have received had he slammed Brady in the endzone when he was talking smack to Smith. It would have made me smile, though .

by _ET_ on Dec 19, 2007 4:54 PM EST up reply actions  

ok cool
I'll check them out at home.

I don't condone what happened in the NBA game, but I just think it's kind of amusing that if NFL players or NBA players fight they're labeled as thugs or out of control, whereas they're revered in the NHL.

by Michael Bean on Dec 19, 2007 4:09 PM EST reply actions  

weird
The different standards that outline what is accepted/unaccepted is really odd from sport to sport such as fighting, steriod use and others that are escaping me right now (help?).
"The more violent team will win tonight" - Mike Tomlin.

by cgolden on Dec 19, 2007 4:23 PM EST up reply actions  

its a standard
you are allowed to drop the gloves and fight in hockey, and there are all kinds of rules about what is ok to do and what is not.

by schnifin on Dec 19, 2007 4:56 PM EST reply actions  

Yeah
Like schnifin said, it's a standard already built into the sport from way back.  Boxing and kickfighting are both totally about fighting, but nobody is really pushing to get them banned as sports or anything like that.  

This reminds me of something I heard Barry Melrose say once, and I think it's true of the NFL to an extent too.  He said that one reason more players were slashing with sticks in the 90's and early 00's was that players allow the league to handle those issues through fines.  He said it was better how it used to be.  Nobody would try attacking a star player with a stick, because they would be punished later on by one of the other team's "enforcers".  

The NFL used to be a bit more like that too. I can't remember where, but I heard another story of the Steelers playing the Broncos, and Lyle Alzado said or did something to Franco.  The team decided to start running every play right at him, and by the 4th quarter, he was whipped.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Dec 19, 2007 5:11 PM EST reply actions  

wolfpack
Who's your adopted Steeler? :)

by Michael Bean on Dec 19, 2007 5:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Not sure if I can
I didn't want to commit, because I'm not sure how much I'll be able to watch tonight.  I've got two young kids, and it makes it hard to follow like it looked like you were asking for.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Dec 20, 2007 3:27 PM EST up reply actions  

Ward
Ok, I just checked the adoption list.  Didn't see anyone take Hines Ward, so I'll do my best on him.  I know, probably an easy one, since he gets highlighted by the broadcasters, but I'll keep an eye out for his play away from the play as well.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Dec 20, 2007 3:55 PM EST up reply actions  

hockey fighting
Proud Canadian, I grew up with fighting as an accepted and even encouraged part of the sport. Fighting has always been one way for players to ''police'' (for lack of a better word) what is happening on  the ice. It's how they minimize intimidating or dirty play by opponents, by making those players accountable when the referees miss something. Of course, fighting is also an intimidating tactic, often forcing other teams to have a designated fighter and leading to the predictable and pointless showdowns between designated goons.  To those of you unfamilliar with hockey, they are definitely real fights and occasionally a guy willl be knocked out or break his hand.  I''ve seen a guy break his leg, falling awkwardly after getting punched. One retired tough guy, Dave Manson, can now barely speak because of a punch in the throat damaging his vocal cords. Some guys' careers have ended as a result of a fight. There are penatlies in place but the only deterrants are misconducts and eventually a suspension for instigating fights. Bench-clearing brawls at the NHL level are a thing of the past,

Gary Roberts is a tough and formerly talented guy who I've followed for more than 20 years. He will ''stand up''' for teammates by challenging opponents who take liberties. But he has been guilty of numerous dirty plays himself, especially with the deterioration of hsi skills, and he is no longer a good enough player to warrant  being considered a leader. He's a fringe player at best but he understands the game and the code of conduct that should exist on the ice.

No one should confuse fighting with leadership. Occasionally there are fights between teams' real leaders, for example the Stanley Cup final a few years ago featured a great fight between Jarome Iginla of the Flames and Vincent Lecavalier of the Lightning. Neither would back down and they went at it. The fight helped set the tone for a very good series. Guys like Chris Pronger use intimidation but that's just the way they play, it's not an essential part  of being a leader. It was the same with Mark Messier. Guys like Steve Yzerman were no less a leader because they did not fight, although Yzerman and even Gretzky had the odd scrap. Gretzky just one I believe. He didn't have to, because there were plenty of teammates who would ''discourage'' anyone from even looking sideways at Wayne.

Aside from box lacrosse, there is no other organized team sport I know of that essentially allows players to fight.  Anyone who plays junior hockey in Canada is  told by his coach or one of the older players or even his dad  to get his first fight out of the way just so he knows what the hell its all about and discourages other teams from trying to intimidate him.

The Steelers need some of their leaders to step up and do what all leaders do, in any sport or even business: Take accountability, set an example in their approach to the job and encourage others to adhieve team goals rather than individual goals.

by steeler lifer on Dec 19, 2007 5:36 PM EST reply actions  

Roberts
My only hockey knowledge came from NHL '93 and '94. I think that was the last video game system I ever owned. Sad for a youngster of my age, but just never got into video games. I think I remember Gary Roberts being pretty badass back then. Was he with the Pens?

by Michael Bean on Dec 19, 2007 5:43 PM EST reply actions  

Roberts
Started with the Calgary Flames and played there many years and had a 50-goal season I believe. Suffered a potentially career ending neck injury. Came back and played well for many years with Carolina and the Leafs before joining Pens.

by steeler lifer on Dec 19, 2007 6:11 PM EST reply actions  

ah yes
I played with him and Theo Fleury (spelling?) Fleury was badass.

by Michael Bean on Dec 19, 2007 7:34 PM EST up reply actions  

You want a leader?
Here is this teams leader: Big Ben

Need proof? He's announced that in honor of his first Pro Bowl selection, he's taking his entire offensive line and thier wives/significant others with him to Hawaii for the week.

In this day of classless athletes Ben stands out as one of the good guys left.

"The more violent team will win tonight" - Mike Tomlin.

by cgolden on Dec 20, 2007 10:59 AM EST reply actions  

lol
maybe he's taking them there to show them how real OL play ball.
"The more violent team will win tonight" - Mike Tomlin.

by cgolden on Dec 20, 2007 1:37 PM EST up reply actions  

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