Draft Projections
Bumped. Fantastic stuff from steeler lifer once again. Thanks as well to maryrose for the mega database he put together. You can get a copy of his work by emailing the address he provides in this diary.
-Blitz-
The Draft is still almost three months away but the cyber world is full of draftniks and prospect gurus. So why should we in Steeler-land be any different? With that in mind, I decided to try to get a handle on who we might end up seeing as new Steelers in late April.
This is not going to be an easy year for the Steelers to make a big splash in the Draft. They don't have a really high pick (23rd overall), nor do they have a lot of picks (six). Nor will they lessen the pressure for a good draft by signing two or three impact free agents. That's just something they don't do. On top of that, they go into the draft needing immediate help on the offensive line and rotation guys on the d-line. Those positions won't provide much help on coverage teams. They also need a kick returner.
We only have six picks, and obviously all of our needs can't be met in the draft. Everyone has their own opinion about the Steelers needs. Here is my top five list:
- Center: We have no upside except longshot prospect Darnell Stapleton or conversion project Simmons.
- Offensive Tackle (even if Starks returns): We don't have a guy who, in two years, we can say for sure will be a first-rate LOT, trusted with protecting our first-rate QB. We need to try to get that guy in this year's draft.
- DE: We have no backups behind Keisel and Smith except longshot prospect Ryan McBean
- LB: We have little depth or quality behind Harrison and Woodley, and Farrior is near the end of his career.
- Kick returner: We have Rossum, nuff said.
As far as the Draft is concerned, obviously there are some good prospects to fill the needs. But our relatively late Draft position, and having just six picks, make it tricky. For example, at No. 23 we may miss out on the consensus top five OTs (Long, Clady, Otah, Baker, Williams). The alleged best center available (Mike Pollak) is a late second-rounder at best but he could be gone by the time we make our third pick. Let's say none of those top five OTs are available, and we pick, for example, a good DL like Kentwan Balmer or DE Philip Merling, in the hope that a good second tier OT is available in the second round. Well, OTs Gosder Cherilus, Carl Nicks and Anthony Collins might also all be gone by the time our second pick rolls around. Left Tackle is a tough position to fill, requiring a better athlete than any other line position, and yet we could easily not get a crack at anyone in the top 10 (by the time our third-round pick rolls around).
With the diversity of needs, I think the Steelers should be looking at trading down. I went through two draft projections, one with the Steelers' current six picks, another after a fictional trade with Buffalo. The purpose was to see what difference a trade might make, from the perspective of losing first-round quality and gaining draft quantity. The proposed trade, Pittsburgh's first-rounder for Buffalo picks in the top half of the 2nd, 3rd and 5th rounds, follows the NFL Draft Value chart. A deal would make sense for Buffalo, too. They have extra picks in the 3rd and 5th rounds. Their top needs are CB, WR and LB. Two first-round picks at No. 11 and No. 23 could be used to meet two of those needs with logical, ready-to-start picks; for example, LB Keith Rivers at No. 11, followed at No. 23 by either a big WR like Malcolm Kelly or James Hardy, or a CB like Antonio Rodgers-Cromartie or Antoine Cason. None of those guys are expected to be around for Buffalo's current second-round pîck. Even with the trade the Bills would also still have picks in the upper half of rounds 3-7. My feeling is that it would be a great trade for the Steelers, and a good one (potentially great) for the Bills.
I tried to be as conservative as possible for each projection. The best resource is NFL Draft Scout. There are plenty of other good sites but that one is updated regularly and has extensive position rankings and draft projections that reflect recent results, workouts, injuries, etc. My guideline was that I couldn't pick a Steeler draftee in that round if NFL Draft Scout had the player ranked higher. I would cross-reference to a number of other mock drafts and try not to be too optimistic that Player X would still be available.
The overall draft number beside the picks takes into account three forfeited draft picks. Draft positions also change in each round because teams that have the same record rotate their draft spots within that group. I used the DraftTek six-round draft as the guideline for position in each round.
In each case I have named at least two possible choices. The first choice would be preferred but the secondary choice tries to take into account earlier picks. I've seen only a handful of these players on TV so this is totally speculative, but their physical attributes, position, statistical performance and style of play combine to make them seem like good additions to the Steelers at this very preliminary point in time.
DRAFT SCENARIOS
CURRENT PICKS
Rnd (No.) Player
- (23) OT Jeff Otah, OT Chris Williams or OT Sam Baker
- (54) C Mike Pollak or DL Dre Moore
- (88) OLB Ezra Butler or DL Kendall Langford
- (149) WR-KR Kevin Robinson or RB Justin Forsett
- (119) DL Kellen Dykes or C Fernando Velasco
- (180) LB Thomas Williams, DE Chase Ortiz or LB-DE Jameel McLain
- No pick
Rnd 1: While it's possible that all five of the top OTs will be gone, it's not unreasonable to expect at least one to be around. I excluded Cherilus from this list because he seems limited to RT only and has dropped in many projections.
Rnd 2: There is a very good chance Pollak will be available, as this is much higher than most projections have him rated. But he's apparently the best center available, played well at the Senior Bowl and might be gone before the late third-round pick. Moore has plenty of detractors but this is where he is slotted and he has talent.
Rnd 3: Athletic LBs with size, speed and college experience at the position are hard to find past this round. Butler, a three-year starter at the SAM position, fits in all three areas and would contribute to special teams. Langford has size and potential. Another possibility is DE Jason Jones or C John Sullivan.
Rnd 4: Robinson had a great NCAA career on PR and KR, and adds depth to WR. Forsett is a third-down back with good hands, quickness and moves, very little kick return experience but has the tools to be a KO return candidate at least.
Rnd 5: Crucial to pick a DL at this point if none taken so far. Dykes should be available (listed sixth-rounder). If we already have a DL but no center, then the best center available might be Velasco.
Rnd 6: Williams was a back-up at all LB positions at USC, played a lot and was named a top special teams performer. Ortiz is an undersized but nonstop, quick DE who could be converted to a two-down ILB or come off the edge, as well as help special teams. McLain is tough, aggressive and another ST contributor.
Summary: Preferred selections for each round would be OT Jeff Otah, C Mike Pollak, OLB Ezra Butler, WR-KR Kevin Robinson, DL Kellen Dykes and LB Thomas Williams. Pollak is obviously a reach but meets the biggest need and will be given every chance to contribute quickly. Butler is risky but a great athlete who should be available. Robinson might be a godsend, DL Kellen Dykes should be useful and the last round is up for grabs among ST contributors..
BUFFALO TRADE VERSION
(1st Rounder for 2nd, 3rd and 5th Rounders)
Rnd (No.) Player
- (41) OT Carl Nicks or OT Anthony Collins
- (54) C Mike Pollak or DL Dre Moore
- (71) RB Matt Forte or DL Kendall Langford
- (88) OLB Ezra Butler or WR Jordy Nelson
- (135) WR-KR Kevin Robinson or RB Justin Forsett
- (119) DL Kellen Dykes or C Fernando Velasco
- (148) SS Caleb Campbell or ILB Spencer Larsen
- (180) LB Thomas Williams, DE Chase Ortiz or LB-DE Jameel McLain
- No pick
Rnd 2: Cherilus is unlikely to be available but another of the second-tier OTs should be at No. 41. Besides Moore, other DL candidates are Trevor Laws and Marcus Harrison.
Rnd 3: LB is a much greater need than RB but if Forte is still available, he would be hard to overlook. An all-purpose runner with strength, some quickness and good hands. He's a very good athlete, likely an upgrade on Davenport and should also contribute on special teams. The advantage of having an extra pick shows up later in the third round. Butler should still be available. If not, three guys who enter the conversation are WR Jordy Nelson, FB Owen Schmidt and FB Peyton Hillis. Nelson is 6-3, 215, good hands and deceptive speed. Schmidt or Hillis would be great additions, but if the Steelers draft Forte, then it's a overkill in an area of limited need.
Rnd 4: Robinson is projected as a fifth-rounder and, if available, should be snapped up. His return numbers (18.9 PR avg!!!!; 29.3 KO avg; four combined kick returns for TDs this year) are so ridiculously good he could get picked anytime from the third round on. If Forte is not in the fold, then you can add third-down RB Justin Forsett to the conversation, and also think about athletic G Donald Thomas.
Rnd 5: DL has to be the priority if none picked to this point. Dykes is a big strong guy and versatile. If we already have a DL but no centre, then the best center available could be Velasco. The later fifth-round choices (SS Campbell and ILB Larsen) are for special teams, depth, and could be joined in the discussion by OL Chad Rhinehart and WR Marcus Monk.
Rnd 6: Same scenario as in the previous draft projection.
SUMMARY: Preferred choices in each round would add up to: OT Carl Nicks, C Mike Pollak, RB Matt Forte, OLB Ezra Butler, WR-KR Kevin Robinson, DL Kellen Dykes, SS Caleb Campbell, LB Thomas Williams.
CONCLUSION: Overall, there seems no doubt that the trade scenario is much better than the status quo. Of course, trades are not easy to make happen but it has been done before and there's no reason to think it can't happen again. It might even be worth lowering the asking price (for example, a 6th or 7th rounder instead of a 5th rounder), just to get those extra picks in the second and third rounds.
I found it tough to upgrade the DL in either of the draft scenarios. None of the guys projected in rounds 2-5 are sure things, a reflection of how tough it is to find quality 3-4 DEs. That's what makes Aaron Smith so valuable, and why Chris Long might go No. 1 overall. For the Steelers, with a limited number of guys to choose later in the draft, it might make sense to use the first pick on a top-end DL such as Kentwan Balmer, Philip Merling, Pat Sims or Calais Campbell, then address OL and LB in rounds 2-4.
Three of the key guys in both draft scenarios are C Mike Pollak, OLB Ezra Butler and WR-KR Kevin Robinson. They each address three key needs but Pollak is probably a reach, Butler has been described as a chronic under-achiever, and Robinson was great on a super bad team in a weak conference. There's no way to know when he will drafted or if he will be successful.
0 recs |
26 comments
Comments
awesome
Your team needs are pretty spot on and the only change I might make is moving OT over C, but thats about the same thing anyways since, like you said, there isn't a stand out Center in this year's draft. The one piece of truthful draft talk from the Steelers so far has been Tomlin admitting that they need some youth in the trenches, both on offense and defense.
On to the players:
- Nicks is an intriguing prospect who's starting to climb the ladder and he looked good at the Senior Bowl. He'd be a nice fall back tackle in the second round if the Steelers miss out on one in the first or pull off a trade.
- Pollack seems like the only center who stood out at the Senior Bowl and watching him battle Ellis in the one on ones was pretty interesting.
- Kevin Robinson is an interesting selection. He could be a nice player and he already has Steeler ties. He broke former Steeler Troy Edwards' (just threw up in my mouth) record for all purpose yards per play by averaging 16.6 yards everytime he touched the ball (previous record 15.8)
- Kendall Langford - I starting to feel like his PR rep so I won't gush anymore over him today.
- Chase Ortiz would be a nice 6th round pick and if you've seen him play much you'll know why. He's undersized to play a 3-4 end and drafting him would throw fuel on the "Tomlin converting the defense fire," but he plays with a motor that could translate over to ILB or special team standout.
by cgolden on Jan 30, 2008 1:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
nicks possible first-rounder
Anyway it's all good debate until the Combine, which will give everyone a better idea of where players are slotted. I'll go through the process again after the Combine and update the scenarios.
by steeler lifer on Jan 30, 2008 6:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Awesome Job Lifer
by 5020 on Jan 30, 2008 2:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Incredible work
by RickVa on Jan 30, 2008 3:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Nice
I think our WR core is good. Even if we cut Ced and let Willie Reid get some more reps, I really like how he moves when he's got the ball in his hands. And maybe see how the other young guys from the practice squad like Baker perform... I really want depth at the lines and LBs first and foremost... maybe another FS to challenge A. Smith if Clark doesn't recover.
by Chicago Steeler on Jan 30, 2008 5:41 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Re Rossum
As for DL, I think that is one of the weaknesses of my two draft scenarios. I have lots of secondary names in consideration but it's very difficult to find talent at the 3-4 DE position. So many college guys are undersized, you end up looking at DTs who might be agile enough to handle the edges and get some penetration.
This is considered a weak year for safeties in the draft. I went for SS Campbell from Navy because he is smart, a big hitter who might be great on special teams and push Smith and Carter for playing time. But that's a draft spot where you could consider another DL like Johnny Dingle.
by steeler lifer on Jan 30, 2008 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
campbell correction
by steeler lifer on Jan 31, 2008 2:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Great work
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 30, 2008 5:46 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I too stand in line with kudos
Anyhow, just think if we could trade our first-rounder for a high second and third, which is quite doable, maybe more.
I'd get two offensive lineman in the second round. Carl Nicks/Gosder Cherilus will be there and they might be real close to who we could get 23rd. The we use our regular pick for the guard spot, Brandon Albert/Robert Felton/Scott Pollack.
We go into round three and grab the DL such as Quentin Groves or if his level is gone, go for the tall receiver Adarious Bowman/Jordy Nelson and then grab the DL Chris Ellis/Chris Harrington.
I'd make that receiver pick a combo returner. With added receiver depth, you could afford to make Santonio a punt returner since he wouldn't be so critical on offense with the new receiver. The new receiver becomes the kick returner and now you've actually bolstered three positions.
Then the fourth round I'd look for Jehuu Caulcrick or Owen Schmitt. I don't trust Najeh, and I think Willie needs help.
After that it's best man available with an emphasis on special teams.
by maryrose on Jan 30, 2008 8:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I too stand in line with kudos
Anyhow, just think if we could trade our first-rounder for a high second and third, which is quite doable, maybe more.
I'd get two offensive lineman in the second round. Carl Nicks/Gosder Cherilus will be there and they might be real close to who we could get 23rd. Then we use our regular pick for the guard spot, Brandon Albert/Robert Felton/Scott Pollack.
We go into round three and grab the DL such as Quentin Groves or if his level is gone, go for the tall receiver Adarious Bowman/Jordy Nelson and then grab the DL Chris Ellis/Chris Harrington.
I'd make that receiver pick a combo returner. With added receiver depth, you could afford to make Santonio a punt returner since he wouldn't be so critical on offense with the new receiver. The new receiver becomes the kick returner and now you've actually bolstered three positions.
Then the fourth round I'd look for Jehuu Caulcrick or Owen Schmitt. I don't trust Najeh, and I think Willie needs help.
After that it's best man available with an emphasis on special teams.
Of course, I don't know what I am talking about but I love the chatter!
by maryrose on Jan 30, 2008 8:09 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Great Draft Strategy
However, I think the key to this year's draft strategy is resigning Max Starks. By doing this, you can draft a LT for the future and let him learn for a year or two before taking over. I believe the Steelers' man will either be Otah or Chris Williams from Vanderbilt. If they decide to go DL first round, I believe it will be the DT from North Carolina.
This is the OL I'd like to see for the Steelers next year from left to right: M. Smith, Chris K., Kendall Simmons, Colon, Max Starks. One important move that I think will be big for this team next year is getting Jason Capizzi on the active squad before the end of the season, meaning they will have a whole offseason to work with him to build his strength and improve his technique. I'm telling you, guys, he's going to be a player. This training camp, he'll have the opportunity to learn RT as well as his natural LT spot and be a swing lineman.
Don't be surprised if this is the draft where Kevin Colbert will move down a couple of slots in the first round. By moving down 3 or 4 spots, they can pick up an extra 3rd and 4th round pick. If they did this, they could still possibly get their LT or even one of the two top 3-4 DEs.
I think this team is in much better shape going into the offseason this year as compared to last year. Here are the reasons:
- Tomlin has a year under his belt. The Steelers knew he wouldn't be ready as a rookie coach, but if they wouldn't have snatched him up when they did, somebody else would have. He's ready to put on his Big Boy coaching pads now.
- No changes on his staff means continuity. That translates to players already knowing the system and can just play instead of thinking. If you don't know how big this is, just check out the Redskins this year or other teams that have 2 new coordinators teaching different systems.
4. The D could legitimately be no. 1 next year. They were paper champs this year. Woodley and Timmons will be in the starting lineup. Add the return of a healthy Aaron Smith, Troy P. and Ryan Clark and some depth, this D could be dominant.
5. If Max Starks is resigned (Faneca's gone), the OL should be a better unit next year because Mahan won't be starting. Also, I think the no. 1 pick at LT, Jason Capizzi, Darnell Stapleton pushing for time at center in his second year and even an improved Trai Essex looking to cash in on free agency will give this line better competition and overall depth.
Some of my biggest concerns are:
- if they don't resign Starks, then they are going to be forced to reach in this draft to try and fill OL holes. If Starks leaves with Faneca, that will be too many holes to fill in one offseason for a franchise that isn't going to spend a lot of money in free agency.
- If K. Colbert wants a better pash rush, then he needs to put better pass rushers on the field. He needs to add a pass rushing DL and another OLB (preferably 2) to this team either through the draft or through free agency that can sack the QB.
- DL depth has to be addressed; maybe John Mitchell can work his magic on McBean this offseason. And forget the moving around Kiesel experiment. Just put him on the field and let him go. If he isn't good enough, put someone else in his spot that is.
5. Jeremy Bloom could surprise as a kick-returner next year. I don't think Willie Reid is the answer as a returner, but he could make the team as a WR because of his speed and quicks. I think there will be 3 WR positions open on this team because Cedric Wilson will not be kept as a 4th WR making $2M a year. Baker "the practice squad maker" has a chance if he shows anything in camp.
I hadn't chimed in awhile, so I just thought I'd let you guys know that the Datruth can still set you free! Keep up the good work, B. Steelers Nation, Be blessed!
by datruth4life on Jan 31, 2008 4:54 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
yay
Gotta point the credit for the post to steeler lifer though, not me :)
by Blitzburgh on Jan 31, 2008 10:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
trading down
The value of trading down from No. 23 to later in the first round works out like this. If the Steelers move down from No. 23 to, say, the Giants' spot at No. 31, they could also get a late third-rounder and a late fifth-rounder according to the Draft Value Chart. The points value system for draft trades can be found at http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/features/valuechart.html
by steeler lifer on Jan 31, 2008 11:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This trading down idea is really growing on me
by cgolden on Jan 31, 2008 12:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
trading down
It's not where you pick or how often you pick, it's who you pick. Even with just six picks, the Steelers could get six valuable players and that's a great draft year for anyone.
If we don't trade down, and if all top five OTs are gone, then things could still turn out just fine. For instance: 1. DE Philip Merling or DL Kentwan Balmer; 2. OLB Erin Henderson or ILB Jerred Mayo; 3. OT John Greco or G-OT Drew Radovich; 4. C Fernando Velasco; 5. SS Caleb Campbell; 6. OLB Thomas Williams or DE Chase Ortiz. With DL on the first round, you don't need to look for anyone else later in the draft at that position. You add two big bodies for the OL to compete immediately at RT and C. You add LB depth and get three guys who should contribute to ST. Not much sizzle in that draft because your top two picks probably won't start right away, but perhaps a lot of steak.
by steeler lifer on Jan 31, 2008 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Inside LB
I haven't been eyeing to many ILBs but have any guys stood out to you guys so far? The only guy I've seen who looks like a mid round prospect was Jonathon Goff (Vanderbilt) and he looked decent in the Shrine Game.
by cgolden on Jan 31, 2008 8:43 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
draft
I like Jordy Nelson and Ezra Butler; Vince Hall and Jonathon Goff are other ILB's I'd look at. Shawn Crable wouldn't exactly fit our current needs at LB (other than depth), but he's an excellent athlete that can get after the QB and would be a steal in the 3rd. There's a decent crop of CB's, and if the price is right, it would be nice to have someone in our secondary who can catch. Draft Scout has Reggie Smith in the second, which would be an excellent fit, since he can play CB or S and is the top KR in the class. The key for us in the early-middle rounds is taking good values. We have many needs right now, so there's no reason to reach for anything other than OL, which is a fairly deep position.
Whatever happens in the early rounds, it would be wise to spend our last few picks on special teamers in Clint Kriewaldt's mold. We don't need any more late round DL's, OL's, or WR's that won't make the roster and can't play ST. Nelson Coleman could develop into a two down run stuffing LB, but he'd be a great ST player for now. Also, we could use a tough blocking TE (Brad Cottam is one possibility) that could also play ST.
by BadMaafala on Jan 31, 2008 10:21 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
i agree
by Blitzburgh on Jan 31, 2008 10:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Inside Backers
I have seen Goff all over the draft boards, from third round to fifth round. Another name is J Leman who could be available as late as the sixth round.
Thomas Williams of USC is under the radar because he didn't even start. But he played behind three great players, all likely high first-rounders (Rivers this year, the other two next year). He started a lot of games due to injuries, including MLB, and was named the team's most inspirational player and best special teamer. It will be interesting to see if his stock rises at the Combine when he gets compared to guys who were starters at other schools.
by steeler lifer on Jan 31, 2008 10:49 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Tavares Gooden....
by TheMostViolentTeam on Jan 31, 2008 11:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
it might say something about me
by TheMostViolentTeam on Jan 31, 2008 2:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Lifer (and others)
by RickVa on Jan 31, 2008 3:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
character issues
But when you are just a fan, well on the outside of what is really going on, it's tough to evaluate the character of a player and say yea or nay on whether he would make, or is, a good Steeler. Personally I believe almost everyone playing in the NFL has the inner qualities necessary to be a good pro and team player, for just about any team. The guys with serious flaws show up pretty quickly.
For something like the draft, it's just a fun exercise based almost entirely on perceived physical tools and the position they play. I know very little about any of these guys. You will see a lot of draft analysts saying things like, ''There are red flags about Player X because of this incident or that published comment'', but I don't think there is any way for an outsider to really know what is going on with that player. On the other hand, there are some college players who lead by example and stand out as high-quality individuals and you have to give some credit for that.
Like you said with Plex, even the guys with an attitude or perhaps selfish behaviour in some respects can be valuable contributors and respected by teammates. In a locker room of 45 guys, there are going to be some extreme personalities. As long as they play hard, who cares?
by steeler lifer on Jan 31, 2008 4:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Holmes is a good example
Najeh is definitely another example.
by cgolden on Jan 31, 2008 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Rachal
The Steelers might sign a veteran free agent OL in March and, if so, that would have a direct bearing on draft strategy.
by steeler lifer on Jan 31, 2008 3:30 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

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