Steelers To Get Bengals Justin Smith???
by Blitzburgh on Feb 11, 2008 11:41 AM EST
in News
11 comments
Ooooh, wouldn't that be a tasty offseason surprise for us. The Bengals franchised Justin Smith last year, paying him $8,644,000 for the season. If they were to do the same this year to retain his services, Smith would earn $8,879,000 despite only tallying 2 sacks and 78 tackles.
I've always liked Justin Smith as a player, and apparently, so does Dick LeBeau, who has been on the record saying that he thought Smith would be better utilized in a 3-4 scheme.
According to the same source, the Steelers may also be interested in Bengals safety Madieu Williams. A Steelers scout lavished him with high praise prior to the 2004 draft, and apparently (lots of apparentlys, I know), the interest in his talent still remains.
So, what to make of this. Obviously Smith would be a fantastic addition, at least in my opinion. Not at that price tag, but if he could be had in the $5-7 million per year range, I sure would hope the Rooneys and Colbert make a big push. I've said it many times before on this site: I just don't think Brett Keisel is quite good enough. He's a valuable asset, somebody I'd love to still have rotating in and out in our front 3. But when Aaron Smith goes down and Keisel is forced to shoulder more of the load in the running game, things fall apart. And despite his impressive athleticism, Keisel doesn't get to the quarterback well enough. We all saw the importance in the Super Bowl of having pass rushers who can pressure the QB without having to sell out your whole defense with an all-out kamikaze blitz. Adding Justin Smith and actually playing LaMarr Woodley would greatly help us move closer towards becoming that type of pressure defense.
As for Madieu Williams, I don't know what to think just yet, as I've never seen him play and we seem to have, at least on paper, plenty of bodies at the safety position. Anthony Smith regressed a bit towards the end of the year, but I think his words and his play against NE kind of sullied an otherwise solid 2nd year for Smith. Tyrone Carter isn't the answer, but he comes on the extreme cheap, so I'm not sure there's much merit to letting him go. And those are the backups! If Troy Polamalu and Ryan Clark return healthy next year, we'd conceivably have 5 safetys on the roster. Since I haven't seen Williams play, I don't know if he can play the nickel or dime position, and I don't know if he can make special teams contributions. Those factors would be important before making any sort of determination.
Steelers fans, thoughts?
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As for Madieu Williams, I can't understand why I keep seeing sites say that safety is an area of need for this team. I've seen mock drafts that have them taking a safety in the second round and I can't help but ask why. Troy and Clark are a formidable duo as starters and Anthony Smith is still very young (25) and despite a rough couple of games, he's flashed great potential several times throughout the last two seasons. With all the obvious holes in both lines, I hope this team doesn't waste time trying to 'shore up' an area that already has plenty of depth.
by cgolden on Feb 11, 2008 12:14 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
hmmm...
I'm never sure what to think of Keisel. Part of me loves the man. I love his enthusiasm and will never forget watching him rush onto the field after a touchdown in the Seattle game without his helmet and still head-butting Ben. I think his pass rush was decent on the whole for a 3-4 end. He got consistent "pressures" although very few sacks. Dr. Z rated him very highly among ends even for a 3-4. But all that said when either he or Smith goes down our defense is apparently shot to hell.
I agree with cgolden in that I'm pretty happy with our safety position. Carter started making me even angrier than Smith by the end of the season with his missed tackles. I'm just keeping fingers crossed for a full season out of Troy. I hope his frame can stand the beating he takes and gives. If we can get someone on the cheap that can also play some coverage teams I'd be more than happy to get them but certainly not the first 3 rounds.
by Chicago Steeler on Feb 11, 2008 12:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is just me being nit-picky...
This just adds to your argument that Cin would be foolish to franchise him.
by _ET_ on Feb 11, 2008 12:32 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Not sure about Justin Smith
- There's the matter of how much he would command on the open market. since he's coming off of a 2 sack season, he might not command big dollars, but I doubt that he would come cheap either. Considering the Steelers cap situation, I don't think they would would be able to outbid, or even match, what he will likely receive from someone else.
- I'm not even sure if he would make a good 3-4 de. Not only do I have concerns about his size (I believe he only weighs about 275, so he would have to add at least 10 pounds), but I'm not sure how much of a pass rush he would generate as a 3-4 de. While he's a high motor guy, he doesn't possess too much speed/agility or pass rush moves to get to the qb. And when watching him play against the Steelers, he's not as good against the run as I thought he would be.
A more interesting guy to go after might be Corey Williams from GB. He's 1 year younger (turns 28 in August) and bigger (6'4", around 315). In addition to his size, he may have the pass rush ability (7 sacks each of the past two years while playing dt) that we need. While I haven't personally seen him play that often, I have heard that he also could be better against the run. But if he was decent against the run while playing in the middle of GB's good defense, he should be at least decent against the run as a 3-4 de.
Granted, he could be very expensive on the FA market, which would make everything I just typed a moot point.
by steeler1275 on Feb 11, 2008 4:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
interesting thoughts
As for Smith, I cant say with complete conviction whether or not he would be a good fit in our 3-4, but if it is true that LeBeau thinks he would be, well then, I guess I'm going to trust his judgment.
He is expensive though, you're right. However, our cap situation isn't quite the mess that some may think it is. The salary cap keeps getting higher and higher, and if we're able to pay Marvel Smith and Kendall Simmons millions each year, I'd like to think we could find a way to pay ~$5 mil per for a upper echelon defensive linemen.
by Blitzburgh on Feb 11, 2008 4:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
cap room
by cgolden on Feb 11, 2008 4:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Justin Smith / Madieu Williams
At the Bungals he has not had Hampton, A Smith, Farrior, Harrison, Woodley, Timmons / Foote, Polamalu surrounding him.
His role would be to rush / stunt allowing Harrison Timmons and Farrior more outlet. With Casey inside and A Smith stopping runs to our left he would be singled up a lot against the LT with the aforementined players supporting him - it would force opposition sides to put in a blocker for Harrison = limiting players downnfield for QB's to throw too. Keisel will be back to his right spot = supporting.
When we move to our Nickel and Dimes he could be a LDE with Woodley a RDE. Smith / Hampton / McBean inside. Timmons WLB / Harrison SLB / Farrior / Foote MLB.
I like Madieau Williams too; alot. He would be a FS in our system - and to a lesser extent a Dime Corner in our coverage systems - would allow Polamalu more room to create or play a role deep.
Both players would be great. Madieau Williams has the potential to be a starting corner in this league. He would be our best catching secondary player if we got him.
He could beat out IKE for the most important cover corner; the LEFT cornerback postion for Right handed QB'S. Yes I am deadly serious.
You could sub in and out Anthony Smith / Ryan Clark (if healthy).
I feel a Hybrid Defense is the way they will go.
You could then spend 5 picks on Offense OLINE / WR's RB's if we made these deals.
I like Kentwan Balmer too. First Round.
Picks 2,3,4,5,7 on Offense.
Love the move; make it happen. If we make this deal / s we improve to 13-3.
Plus they don't move far and they play under Lebeau; and get away from that losing culture at the Bungals.
We and they certainly could do far, far worse than that.
Where do we sign?
In a 3-4 1 gap scheme that Tomlin plays; yes it is not the Belichick / Parcells boring 2 gap (Why waste Seymour / Warren) from getting pressure / sacking quarterbacks it would mean more pressure and allowing our FS and SS to play deep knowing we would not have to blitz 5 guys to get pressure.
As the Giants showed if you can get pressure from your front 4 you can succeed. However in our 3-4 what other guy is coming. Blitz 4! What 4 from the Steelers are coming.
That is the beauty of the 3-4. The 1 gap 3-4.
I am ready for some football.
No Corey Williams: Not our style of Defense a pure 2 gapper. He is looking for a massive paycheck. Like 6.5 / 7 Mill a year. Justin Smith and Williams would be great here.
Justin Smith = 5 yrs at 5.2 / 5.5 a year is a bargain.
by wiggins on Feb 11, 2008 8:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
welcome to BTSC
by cgolden on Feb 12, 2008 8:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
great thoughts
I like Justin Smith a lot and I agree that he might be a very good fit for our 3-4. Keisel would still get a lot of snaps and that would make all the DEs more effective. McBean is also a forgotten guy who could make a contribution next year and a draft pick would add to the depth. The result is that we upgrade our starting d-line and significantly upgrade our DE backups: Keisel and McBean (or a draftee) replacing Eason and Kirschke.
But there are a few things that weigh against it. Smith's not a really big guy and can be run at. He's not a young guy. Both of them add up to being contrary to the view expressed by Tomlin that the team needs to get younger and bigger up front.
The other thing is that he is going to be expensive. I can't believe he will only get in the $5 million range. With his resume and recent salary, he is going to command some major bucks, probably in excess of $6 million and perhaps way more than that. Can we afford to spend that much is one question, the other is SHOULD we spend that much on just one guy when there are other positions (OL, RB and perhaps LB depth) that could also use some upgrading by mid-tier free agents. We'll know more about our cap space in the near future but I'm not optimistic that we can sign more than a couple guys. Given the Steelers history, me might sign just one.
I don't know enough about Madieu Williams. You could always use a good cover guy and perhaps he would also contribute to special teams. I just don't agree that the secondary is a free agent need. I'd be happy with an upgrade on Tyrone Carter and we might be able to do that cheaply with an undrafted free agent or a late draft pick.
by steeler lifer on Feb 12, 2008 7:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Starks A Priority
Starks played good football last year before he got hurt, particularly at left tackle. With M. Smith's tricky back, I just think this team would be putting itself in a hole by not resigning Starks. Losing Starks and Faneca would leave too many holes on this line to try an plug up in one season.
By resigning Starks, I think you have a line that you can work with. From left to right, you'd have Smith, Chris K., Simmons or Stapleton, Colon and Starks, with the no. 1 pick OL from Virginia (that's my guess who they'll take), Capizzi, Essex, Mahan, and another player.
That's a good start to rebuilding the OL I think. The team can then go DL in second and best pass rusher available in the 3rd.
Your thoughts?
by datruth4life on Feb 14, 2008 2:23 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
what if?
by cgolden on Feb 14, 2008 9:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
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