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Patriots filmed Steelers 4 times

Bumped. I've been holding out on commenting on this situation until I got my thoughts/feelings in line. I'm close and will probably sound off as to why this whole cheating ordeal is so important. For now, use this thread to discuss the details and lament the fact that that scumbag and his cohorts perhaps took away our 'one for the other thumb'.

-Blitz-

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08046/857665-66.stm?cmpid=steelers.xml

"U.S. Sen. Arlen Specter said yesterday that he has a list of witnesses and will pursue the "Spygate" case against the New England Patriots that he said involved four games against the Steelers, including two AFC championship games.

"I think Steelers fans have a lot to be concerned about this and I'm one of them,'' Mr. Specter told the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette in an interview yesterday, adding that "maybe Steelers ownership should think about it a little.""

This information gives Hines Ward's comments a little more credence.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/2007-09-12-1294083353_x.htm

"PITTSBURGH -- Wide receiver Hines Ward suspects the New England Patriots may have had some type of inside information on the Pittsburgh Steelers before at least one of the teams' two AFC championship game matchups since the 2001 season.

Ward is certain the Patriots, while known for the thoroughness of their scouting under coach Bill Belichick, had some kind of unusual help before their 24-17 upset victory in Pittsburgh in the January 2002 AFC championship game. The Patriots went on to win the first of their three Super Bowls.

"Oh, they knew," Ward said Wednesday. "They were calling our stuff out. They knew, especially that first championship game here at Heinz Field. They knew a lot of our calls. There's no question some of their players were calling out some of our stuff.""

Can't say this makes me feel all warm and fuzzy about the Patriots and Belichick.  Especially after watching them spank us in those championship games.  

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That is pretty damn depressing
Just imagine if the Steelers would have won the '01 & '04 AFC championship games and then went on to win those Super Bowls against STL and PHI. The Steelers would have 7 Super Bowls and be the only franshise with two dynasties.
"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 15, 2008 9:38 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Assuming we won those SBs
I agree, it's depressing.  We could have been looking at another dynasty, but that also assumes that we won both SBs.  The Rams were pretty good that year in 2001.  And, in 2004, we would have had a rookie QB starting.  Well, maybe.  If we won the SB in 2001, then Kordell may have still been QB.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 15, 2008 1:00 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

outcome of games
Cowher mentions in that first article that it didn't change the outcome of the games. He's being a company man here. I'm not saying the Steelers would have one all those games (they lost 3 of 4 and both Championship games of course) but it couldn't have helped them any. I guess we'll never know. I know players and coaches try to get any edge they can, but grabbing a shirt or pushing off or whatever is one thing, stealing signals is just underhanded. I want to see a game played on as level a playing field as possible.
"It's time to plant some seeds. What that means is, hit them in the mouth. Ya know, plant some seeds. Show 'em what time it is." --Levon Kirkland

by steelerinchicago on Feb 15, 2008 2:14 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Company line
Yeah, Cowher is taking the company line.  I think a lot of the owners/players who say that it didn't impact outcomes are saying that because they realize (or fear) that this could have a larger impact that just to the Patriots.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 15, 2008 2:23 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

just playing Devil's advocate
But could they be saying that b/c they realize most teams do try and steal signs in some form or another. I don't think other teams are as blatant at video taping signs but there has to be a reason why coaches cover their mouth when they call plays.
"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 15, 2008 2:26 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

If
it comes out that this happens all the time I will be the first to say, ok it was an even playing field.  But as it is now the Patriots seem to have gone above and beyond reading lips and guessing at what signals might mean.  
"It's time to plant some seeds. What that means is, hit them in the mouth. Ya know, plant some seeds. Show 'em what time it is." --Levon Kirkland

by steelerinchicago on Feb 15, 2008 2:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Absolutely
But that's the question about the whole thing.  Sure, guys cover their mouths keep from having their lips read, and it's common to assign a backup player to try to decipher hand signals, etc.  But, it sounds like the Pats' deal was much more detailed.  There still hasn't been an adequate explanation of the suspicious RF signals at Pats' games.  Check out the stories about Ernie Adams that I have in my diary above this one.  He is an assistant with Pats that almost no one has heard of, nobody is ever allowed to talk to, and has a photographic memory.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 15, 2008 2:45 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Correction
Since Blitz bumped this to the main page my diary is now above the "Belicheat taping since 2000" diary.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 15, 2008 2:51 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

interesting article
It was pretty interesting how nobody knows what he does, just that he's always there. I'd love to hear from some former coaches of his in Cleveland to know if he was taping there as well.
"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 15, 2008 2:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Asterick Nation?
Can we change Patriot Nation to Asterick Nation?  Honestly it feels so shady... Cowher agrees that it gives a competitive advantage, but didn't impact the game?  Come on now.  If it's an advantage it impacts the game.  I'll agree that you might be able to play through it and still win if your skill levels and execution are that much better but when it's close then fore-knowledge will obviously make a huge difference.  

Also we know for sure that it went on for at least 7 years.  Belichick isn't someone to waste his time with something every single week, every single game unless he's confident it's helping him to win.  

My be all end all is I want some explanation from Goodell on this.  Why this was swept under the rug.  Why no suspension was given.  etc. etc.

by Chicago Steeler on Feb 15, 2008 3:04 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

lol
I vote for this as their official name. No longer Pats nation, Asteriks nations. And the Pats SBN blog, Pats Pulpit? Now called Astericks Pulpit.

+1 for Chicago Steeler

by Blitzburgh on Feb 15, 2008 5:45 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Tricksters
In my opinion the entire Patriot organization is comprised of tricksters, swindlers, and shifty go betweens.  I've never liked them for all of the obvious reasons and I've been wishing for Tom Brady to be give the Palmer treatment for some time.  I believe the reason nothing major has been done is because Robert Kraft is one influential man - he's on five or six of the key owner committees.  I'm also taking a sick pleasure in the vilification of the Patriots - their pro bowl representatives getting booed was just great.  Karma is a B

by smashmouthsteel on Feb 15, 2008 3:42 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

T-Shirts
They do that with all the losing teams stuff.  Kids in Africa are wearing shirts advertising the Seahawks as SB XL Champs.

by Romain El 82 on Feb 15, 2008 11:44 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Saving the game
I believe that Cowher and the Rooneys are down playing Spygate because the Patriots won't be the only ones hurt if the truth got completely out. If questions are raised about the integrity of some of the recent championships, then the foundation of the league and the business of professional football are at significant risk. With that in mind, thank God the Pats didn't go undefeated this year.

by RickVa on Feb 15, 2008 5:05 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Exactly
They don't want to have the black eye on the entire sport that baseball is getting these days from the Mitchell report.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 15, 2008 5:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

good point
So far, football is the only sport without 'integrity' concerns. Baseball has thier steriods controversy and basketball has the referee gambling controversy. It's entirely possible that Goddell was just trying to put out the fire without ever really researching the cause or extent of it.
"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 18, 2008 8:21 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Dan Rooney should show his balls - not flaps now
Dan Rooney should show that he has balls - Like Art (Who canned that
Cowher loser - pity 8 seasons too late) And investigate this further.

We were robbed in at least 1 AFCC title game it seems.

Dan seems to care more about his image in the NFL than wanting a
'super power' Steelers football team.

Get tough Dan - or piss off and let Art take over.

Art is ruthless - Dan Rooney's title as 'head honcho' has been poor in
winning Superbowls.
A somewhat lucky win, and having a coach who still can't win the big
one. Big Ben and the players won in spite of Cowher - Cowher to me is
still a loser and always will be. Tell me how a coach who has sole
rights on 3-4 OLBS (DE's) for a decade can't win a superbowl. Running
with 11 men in the box don't work in playoffs. Thanks Bettis! (most
overrated Steeler ever - is fat Jerome)

Hopefully Art cans people's asses quickly if they aren't performing.
Coaches and players alike.

You listening Larry Foote and Brett Keisel. Both are poor in stopping the run.

Keisel in a turnstile at RDE He ain't no 2 gapper; and Foote talks too
much. Timmons is quicker and has more cunte than Foote.

Dan Rooney and Cowher will go down in Steeler folklore as LOSERS. Dick
Lebeau is becoming one of the 2 aforementioned losers. 1 more year
dick and its Tomlin's team outright.

Lebeau has 1 SB victory in 50 yrs playing and coaching. It says alot
that stat. A leader and innovative player / coach should have at least
6 in that time frame, even if the side he represents is poor in
certain areas.

I am on to Dick Lebeau and his 'overrated' defenses.

Throw Slants, sideways, WR screens, Bubble screens and you will always
beat Lebeau. His defense is based on a QB throwing the ball downfield
- if they don't Dick Lebeau's defense is toast.

From the likes of the NYT article today, it looks like they might be
downplaying it because they were involved in the cover-up.

If it turns out to be true that Dan Rooney--the boss of our favorite
team--knew from Goodell that the Steelers were being taped multiple
times and he advised Goodell to cover it up, who exactly IS on our
side as Steeler fans? As Steeler fans that demand that our favorite
team's games be played fairly. Not the Rooneys, that's for sure.

Now, if it turns out that Goodell almost fully misled Rooney about the
content of the tapes, then that's a different story.

But more and more, I don't see how the latter can be true. The
evidence is made public that the Steelers were taped multiple times
over the past 6 years, and the Rooneys release a press statement
saying "no big deal."

I'll follow the story until all the evidence presents itself, but if
at the end of the day it's true that Rooney is so unconcerned about
the desire for Steelers fans to have their favorite team compete on an
even playing field, and if the other owners in the league are also in
cahoots and therefore unconcerned about the desire for their fans to
see their favorite teams compete on an even playing field, then I
think I may just give up on watching the NFL completely.

by wiggins on Feb 16, 2008 8:17 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

it continues to
amaze me how a coach can be at one place for 15 years, have the highest win percentage in the history of a very storied franchise, go to the playoffs his first six years straight, win 8 division titles, make the playoffs 10 times, go to SIX afc championship games, make 2 superbowls and win one, be one of only six coaches in NFL history to claim at least seven division titles, and have only 3 losing seasons be labeled as a 'loser'.  You clearly don't understand the meaning of the word.  Let me help you out:

losĀ·er[loo-zer] -noun

  1. a person, team, nation, etc., that loses: The visiting team was the loser in the series.  
  2. Informal. a. a person who has been convicted of a misdemeanor or, esp., a felony: a two-time loser.  b. a person who has failed at a particular activity: a loser at marriage.  c. someone or something that is marked by consistently or thoroughly bad quality, performance, etc.: Don't bother to see that film, it's a real loser.  
  3. Slang. a misfit, esp. someone who has never or seldom been successful at a job, personal relationship, etc.  
Does that help at all?  It is a confusing word.

Oh, and Fat Bettis?  5th all time on the rushing list???  5th?  For a bruising up the middle back to get that high on the list is not only astounding its Hall of Fame worthy.   I can take a lot of things, and I love this site, but I'm not going to just let garbage like this slide by.  If you want to post intelligent stuff on this site then do so.  If you want to sit here and call people idiot names and show your ignorance, then go to stillers.com, you'll be much happier.

by steelerark on Feb 16, 2008 12:19 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Agree with Steelerark
Seems like I usually agree with steelerark. During Cowher's 15 years in Pittsburgh, the Steelers won more games in that span than any other team.  He may have only won one SB, but I don't know if he had teams overachieving or just struggled in the big game.  I know he never had consistency at QB.  With the way Slash played his first year as starter, it's hard for me to fault him on sticking with him as long as he did.  I also know that the great Chuck Noll had not won 10 games in a season in over 10 years when Cowher got there.  I'm not knocking Noll, he's a legend.  But, that goes to show how hard it is to be consistently good, which by and large Bill Cowher's teams were.  One other thing about Cowher.  In SB XL, I think one of the biggest reasons the Steelers won is that he handled the questionable calls better than Holmgren did.  While Holmgren was whining about about whether Ben got in or whether the officials should have called pass interference on Jackson or holding on Locklear, Cowher was telling the team to be ready for Hasselbeck's fumble to overturned.  Holmgren was still thinking about what went against him, while Cowher was telling the team to overcome.  Same thing as the horrible call against Indy where Troy's INT was overturned.

And, fat Bettis?  Are you kidding me?  He was awesome for years, with a very inconsistent passing game.  Then, he chose to take a pay cut to finish his career as a Steeler as a situational player instead of trying to start somewhere else.  No way do we make the playoffs in '05 without the Bus.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 16, 2008 6:47 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

It is not that I dislike Lebeau, Cowher, Bettis,
It is not that I dislike Lebeau and Cowher but they have not produced results. Cowher / Lebeau (Here and at Bungals) have had the sole rights to 3-4 OLB's (DE's) for about 8 yrs. 1 Title.

Lebeau cannot beat a spread offense. FACT. Lebeau beats teams QB's who throw vertically, a QB who throws sideways, and backwards he cannot stop.

He couldn't beat Montana and now Brady as these QB's do not throw 'vertically'.

Cowher coached in a division which stunk for years, and a conference that also was putrid. 1 Superbowl. Loser.

How people can rationalise losing 4 AFCC at home is delusional.

Bettis nearly gave the game away vs Colts in 05 which summed up his career. Thanks Ben. Against cheats in another AFCC at home (Thanks loser Bill and Jerome) 11 carries 4 yards. A big time player is Bettis. Yeah. Loser. Bettis / Lebeau / Cowher / Dan Rooney = Losers of the highest standard possible.

It can be said Tomlin's 1 ring for the Buccs = Lebeau's career already - from the standpoint of Rings. Lebeau was a specialist coach for years as Tomlin had been.

This franchise and its 3-4 Defense needs urgent help, if you read my other diary entries I know how to build teams. For 3-4 or 4-3 defenses. And yes I have been a scout and have coached at a high level.

The 3-4 in PITTSburgh has produced 1 'lucky' Ring. Hasselback had no trouble in dissecting it; and if Roeth does not run it (he didn't get in) on 3rd down = 3 points. If Hope had not got that call in the endzone (no foul on that play) = 11 saved points for the Seahawks.

We won by 10. 11-10 = 1.

Steelers lose to Seattle in the Superbowl by 1 point. You get it?  

In a 3-4 defense you need excellent corners - as most 3-4 teams are exclusively 'cover 3'. Antoine Cason (read my mock draft diary for improvement)

Cowher and Lebeau's (himself a CB) inability to find CB's who can play Zone has stopped us from winning more SB's.

Cowher's inability to find a QB in his early years sum up his coaching standpoint. Trade up and get one. You give up 1,2,3,4 picks to get a future franchise QB don't you?

The thing that somes up Cowher was He did not want Big Ben. He wanted Phillip Rivers (Terrible throwing action no power) and Dante Hall or Shaun Andrews as the pick 11 in Ben's draft year.

Cowher will never understand how to win big games, as well as QB play (Players won in spite of him in 05) and Lebeau and Cowher respectively will not understand how to draft Corner's who play well in Lebeau's (Stop vertical attack only) defense.

If you are climbing the ladder in your workplace, will an employer give you 16 yrs (in Cowher's tenure) and (50 in Lebeau's tenure as coach player) to reach the pinnacle of your profession.

If they do let me know where you work!

by wiggins on Feb 17, 2008 12:07 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

dead on
It floors me how a Steeler fan can't stand the Rooneys, Cowher, LeBeau, and Bettis. That's basically Steeler heresy isn't it?
"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 18, 2008 8:32 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Well now
That was quite a tirade wiggins. Steelerark, good defense of coach and player (though I think we can agree they really don't need it if all parties are rational). Let me try to make the case for the owner.

Let's get one thing straight. the National Football League has not always been a multi-billion (that's BILLION with a 'B') cash cow. It took a number of smart, rather shrewd characters quite some time to build the league into the unqualified success it is today. One of those people is Dan Rooney. Most of today's more celebrated owners; the Jerry Jones, Robert Kraft, Daniel Snyder (kidding) are just harvesting a crop that was planted and cultivated by the Rooneys, the Maras, the Halas. Its important to point that out because we need to be clear that winning championships are at best the SECOND most important thing to these owners. Like all businessmen the first most important thing is to turn a profit. Wiggins, your final statement would explain exactly why the temptation, the smart move really, would be to handle this thing internally and keep it under wraps. If it becomes clear that the playing field has not always been level then not just you, but a lot of people go away. And it may be hard if not impossible to get them all back no matter if all the evildoers are caught and punished, the damage to the GAME (read business) is done and may be irreversible.

Consequently, this is not about showing one's balls. This is about preserving the game to the point that we continue to care about participating at a site like this even though next season is a full seven months away. This is about being smart.

by RickVa on Feb 16, 2008 12:59 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Wigging Out
Take a breath Wig. I am very impressed with your strong fingers allowing you to type so many words. I also respect your right to have an opinion. Like Rick and Ark I need to defend some real good guys you have blasted.
ROONEY built the league as you know it. He has kept football in Pittsburgh. Unlike the Modell's and Irsay's of the world, moving vans have not taken our team to some far away city for billions in profit. The Rooney income is solely based on the NFL. He is not making his money on Microsoft or Starbucks but on the NFL's popularity. He is doing what is smart publicly regardless of what he feels privately.
COWHER was not the greatest X and O man that ever coached but he was a damn good coach that kept the Steelers competitive year in and year out. He had his players selling out game in and game out through his emotional motivation. When he ran into a better X and O man in a big game he usually got beat but he did get us there. He also did get us the elusive one for the thumb riding the emotion of one Jerome Bettis.
BETTIS may have been fat but he was the entire offense for many years. While teams stacked 8 men in the box Bettis ran for 10K. Dude even took a shot in the groin trying to get himself ready for a playoff game after he carried them there on his back. I don't know about you Wig but I would NEVER want a shot in my groin.
LEBEAU was one of the greatest DB to ever play the game. He is one of the great players of yesteryear that helped build this league. When he retired he was top 3 in interceptions in league history...during an era where QB's threw the ball 10 times a game. His play on the field alone is enough to get him in the Hall. As a coach he was an architect of the 3/4 which changed the game. I will not apologize for him that he has only won one championship. Some greats have never sniffed one championship.
While you seem to have no respect for Rooney, LeBeau, Bettis and Cowher you seem to have an affinity for BRUCE ARIANS. Case closed.
When You Run The Ball Good Things Happen

by 5020 on Feb 16, 2008 3:33 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Strong, long and big fingers = big ****
It is not that I dislike Lebeau and Cowher but they have not produced results. Cowher / Lebeau (Here and at Bungals) have had the sole rights to 3-4 OLB's (DE's) for about 8 yrs. 1 Title.

Lebeau cannot beat a spread offense. FACT. Lebeau beats teams QB's who throw vertically, a QB who throws sideways, and backwards he cannot stop.

He couldn't beat Montana and now Brady as these QB's do not throw 'vertically'.

Cowher coached in a division which stunk for years, and a conference that also was putrid. 1 Superbowl. Loser.

How people can rationalise losing 4 AFCC at home is delusional.

Bettis nearly gave the game away vs Colts in 05 which summed up his career.

It can be said Tomlin's 1 ring for the Buccs = Lebeau's career already - from the standpoint of Rings. Lebeau was a specialist coach for years as Tomlin had been.

This franchise and its 3-4 Defense needs urgent help, if you read my other diary entries I know how to build teams. For 3-4 or 4-3 defenses. And yes I have been a scout and have coached at a high level.

The 3-4 in PITTSburgh has produced 1 'lucky' Ring. Hasselback had no trouble in dissecting it; and if Roeth does not run it (he didn't get in) on 3rd down = 3 points. If Hope had not got that call in the endzone (no foul on that play) = 11 saved points for the Seahawks.

We won by 10. 11-10 = 1.

Steelers lose to Seattle in the Superbowl by 1 point. You get it?  

In a 3-4 defense you need excellent corners - as most 3-4 teams are exclusively 'cover 3'. Antoine Cason (read my mock draft diary for improvement)

Cowher and Lebeau's (himself a CB) inability to find CB's who can play Zone has stopped us from winning more SB's.

Cowher's inability to find a QB in his early years sum up his coaching standpoint. Trade up and get one. You give up 1,2,3,4 picks to get a future franchise QB don't you?

The thing that somes up Cowher was He did not want Big Ben. He wanted Phillip Rivers (Terrible throwing action no power) and Dante Hall or Shaun Andrews as the pick 11 in Ben's draft year.

Cowher will never understand how to win big games, as well as QB play (Players won in spite of him in 05) and Lebeau and Cowher respectively will not understand how to draft Corner's who play well in Lebeau's (Stop vertical attack only) defense.

If you are climbing the ladder in your workplace, will an employer give you 16 yrs (in Cowher's tenure) and (50 in Lebeau's tenure as coach player) to reach the pinnacle of your profession.

If they do let me know where you work!

by wiggins on Feb 16, 2008 11:43 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

we get it
One of the the great things about this site is that everyone reads all the comments so you don't have to constantly repeat yourself. Just b/c someone doesn't agree with your opinion doesn't mean you have to justify it, or repeat it word for word several times.

Everyone's opinion is valued the same here and we welcome all new comers, but you don't have to post the exact same comment in three different places.

"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 18, 2008 8:59 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

As for Arians
Yeah Ben has his best year, feels free calls plays Arians is terrible. (Looking up on last poster - eyes).

Arians plays more of the spread offense - Yes he may dislike running like some other 'losing' coaches over the years but he has 'nutured Manning and is on with Big Ben'.

Arians was a Northcutt (drop - he never drops balls - bullshit) from beating us with the Browns - the lowly Browns at this point.

Holcombe threw for 400 yds on a 'slice and dice - spread the Steelers out scheme on offense.

Tomlin, Arians are the two best coaches we have.

Arians will be successful here if Ben learns to throw the ball away, and stop holding the ball for sooooooooooo long.

Big Ben thinks he has 10 seconds to throw on some plays, Ben; quick release hit the open man.

Big Ben and not Arians 'Offense' cost us a rematch (where I fancied us very much) against the Pats in the 2nd week of the playoffs.

If people on here think Ben did not 'lose' that game for us - I am afraid you (ain't got no idea) about Football.

by wiggins on Feb 16, 2008 11:53 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Wiggins a Seahawk?
Are you kidding me?  No offensive pass interference on that call.  Isn't that usually what they call it when a receiver stops, puts his hand on a defender, and then pushes him away as he's changing direction?  And, you can't tell if Ben got in or not on that run, but Cowher had already said they were going for it if the call was overturned.  So, if they score the TD, then no change in score, if they don't then, it's minus 7.  But, since it was initially ruled a TD, and there was not indisputable video evidence, it was a TD.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 18, 2008 10:04 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

reminds me of burghman13
If you can't remember who that is just look back at diaries posted in early December.
"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 18, 2008 10:30 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Me too
Except burghman hated Tomlin.  Wiggins, apparently, can't stand anyone else in Steelers upper management, or Bettis or Cowher.  Next, he'll be blasting Hines Ward for being too short, or something.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 18, 2008 1:51 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

go to the
site, stillers.com and check out how they talk.  This guy is just like them: unintelligent, unreadable and unlikeable.  I feel like I need to buy some crackerjack to try to find a decoder ring.  I'll be right back, I have to post this on three other threads...

by steelerark on Feb 18, 2008 4:24 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

haha
Whats been going on here i leave for about 2 weeks and i come  back to this shit.  man oh man,  maybe i shouldnt leave this site for to long or before long this site will be full of burghmans.
* till next time wave those towels proud

by LiveinDCbutsteelerfanbyheart on Feb 18, 2008 12:16 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

wiggin out about....?
wow!dude are you sure you don't want to be a Ravens fan?they do have Ray Ray...and maybe they will get some players and some coaching you can root for ,you know,instead of bashing OUR players and coaching.if you do decide to stay a Steeler....why dont you try being a little thankful you aren't a fan of one of the teams in the NFL that constantly miss the playoffs.like the Browns or the Lions....who have really bad coaching and front office.when was the last time you saw a Steeler with a bag on his head?

by zenhas12strings on Feb 19, 2008 12:08 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Just because you dislike a former head coach
does not mean I am a gayven fan or some other crudd team.

I am not the person who wrote diaries in December.

I love Mike Tomlin.

Again I state facts; and ask this simple question.

Cowher's inability to find a QB in his early years sum up his coaching standpoint. Trade up and get one. You give up 1,2,3,4 picks to get a future franchise QB don't you?

The thing that somes up Cowher was He did not want Big Ben. He wanted Phillip Rivers (Terrible throwing action no power) and Dante Hall or Shaun Andrews as the pick 11 in Ben's draft year.

Cowher will never understand how to win big games, as well as QB play (Players won in spite of him in 05) and Lebeau and Cowher respectively will not understand how to draft Corner's who play well in Lebeau's (Stop vertical attack only) defense.

If you are climbing the ladder in your workplace, will an employer give you 16 yrs (in Cowher's tenure) and (50 in Lebeau's tenure as coach player) to reach the pinnacle of your profession.

If they do let me know where you work!

Heresy is what Cowher made fans go through in 4 AFCC's at home.

by wiggins on Feb 19, 2008 6:22 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

cowher fault?
there is a 53 man roster...they actually play the game.....maybe they had something to do with it.just be happy you saw 4 afc champ. games.and if these allegations against the Pats are true....maybe cowher would have had more rings.

by zenhas12strings on Feb 19, 2008 7:24 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes.
"If you are climbing the ladder in your workplace, will an employer give you 16 yrs (in Cowher's tenure) and (50 in Lebeau's tenure as coach player) to reach the pinnacle of your profession."

The answer to your question is yes.  Primarily because of the word "pinnacle".  How many companies have long standing CEO's but the company is not #1 in its product line?  

Or to take it down a notch...  Do you fire a consultant who is consistently among your top 5 earners but only once has been #1?  Of course you don't, that man is making a lot of money for the company.

Same deal with Cowher, the man won.  A lot.  The amount of coaches with multiple rings is very low.  

by Chicago Steeler on Feb 19, 2008 10:20 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

So you're saying
that Cowher had final say his entire tenure on which players were drafted, and which were lost free agency?  It was his fault that Kordell turned into a head case after one good season as starting QB?  I was as unhappy as anyone after those AFCC losses, but I'd rather be there than averaging 8-9 wins a season, like the '80s.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 19, 2008 11:16 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

actually
Cowher wanted an O-lineman in that draft, not Big Ben.  Dan Rooney overruled him and they took Ben.  Considering Cowher never had a "franchise" QB as you say......then he must have done a hell of a coaching job leading the team to the best record in the league in that span.

by TheMostViolentTeam on Feb 19, 2008 3:14 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

it's a dark mark for the nfl and for the pats
And it's unfortunate that it took place, whether it changed the game or not, but the present is a lot more important.
Joe Greene had a comment when they defeated the Oilers in the Championship during their 3rd or f4th superbowl run, when there had been a bad call by the refs that took away a Oiler td. Win or loss, his point was it was a bad call that stayed with the game years later. These incidents may overshadow the game.
Also, the Rooneys, Dan especially has always been a guardian of the league. Other owners, Al Davis for instance, would have no problem leveling a lawsuit against the Pats, but the Rooney Steelers are never going to take that path. All the more so because of the close ties to the current commish.
I dislike the Pats, I dislike Billy and these events do not shock me. But the retribution I would be happiest seeing is the Steelers to beat the Pats every time they play.

by vherub on Feb 20, 2008 11:56 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

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