I AM NOT MEL KIPER
by grapes on Dec 12, 2009 6:44 PM EST
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PrintI'm no Mel Kiper so I would like some help with this one. Reading many of the posts it seems like opinions vary wildly on what position to go after in round #1. On defense in seems we need help at all the levels (secondary, linebacker, and line). Do we go after an ilb to replace Farrior? A nosetackle to replace Hampton if he is unsigned? A corner or safety to help out Troy? How about the offensive lineman people have been screaming for? I guess the only places we wouldn't go in round one is QB, WR, and RB. To me it's a toss up as to which defensive position needs to be filled immediately.
Keep the following in mind, we have not drafted a corner #1 since 1997 (Chad Scott) and we have not drafted two players back to back #1 at the same position since 1999-2000 with Edwards/Burress (what does that say about Troy Edwards?). Really the only two non productive #1 picks in the last fifteen years or so have been Edwards (99) and the nearly all pro Jamaine Stephens (96).
Obviously where we go depends upon our draft position and who has not been taken in front of us. For the sake of this discussion lets assume we draft somewhere between 12-20. The other consideration is to we draft someone we feel can start right away, or do we look longer term. I am not a patient person, so would go for the former (but then again I don't run a football team).
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My thoughts
In the range you give us the likelihood of there being a CB or Safety available that is worthy of that spot is unlikely. Berry, Haden, and Mays are your candidates, but they will be gone. Earl Thomas, Ras I Dowling might be there but I think that is to high for them. I don’t think we address offensive line at those positions either. I believe we will sit tight with Starks and Colon at tackle, but could improve at RG. There isn’t a guard prospect that will go that high and rarely is one taken in the first round. Hence, I believe we will take the best Defensive player available. There is chance McLain is available at 12 and Cody and William, NT Tenn, should be there as well although one of them will probably be gone. Other DB’s to watch are Patrick Robinson or Lindley at CB and Morgan Burnett at S. Jason Pierre-Paul is a name to watch for at DE.
Depends on who's available
pick 20 we’ll have the options to get Texas S Earl Thomas, GT S Morgan Burnett, and Virginia’s CB Ras-I Dowling who will probably convert to a FS in the pros. Ofcourse the long shot that everyone is dreaming about is Eric Berry. Even if we lose out the rest of the year we would still have to trade up to get him. Personally I think USC S Taylor Mays is going to be a bust, unless he converts to OLB. But if the top CB in Hayden is gone but Bama ILB Rolando McClain is available I would say we draft him. It’s not out biggest position of need but we can’t pass on a talent like that. Hopefully we can resign Hampton to a reasonable contract which would allow us to put off finding a NT for another year. Outside of “Mount” Cody and Dan Williams, there really aren’t any other NT’s that wouldn’t be considered projects. Picking a guard in the first round, especially before pick 20, would be a waste. Only Mike Iupati is considered a fringe first rounder. Bama’s Mike Johnson, Illinois’ John Asamoah, and Arkansas’ Mike Petrus will all be available in rounds 2 and 3.
I see Burnett or Thomas being a bit of a reach at the 20 spot as of now, but could all change come draft day. Your thoughts? I like Dowling in that area for sure. Couldn’t agree more about Mays being a bust at safety, could see him make a pretty good OLB. Seems to get out of position far to often in the pass game and looks for the big hit instead of wrapping up. Agree drafting a guard in the first is unnecessary. Plenty of good talent there later in the draft especially in the second round. Really like Iupati and Johnson. Johnson was a mauler during the SEC championship game. I would think alot of the draft is going to predicated on what happens with Hampton. If we don’t resign him or go after a FA, I think it becomes the top priority since we have no one to step in. I also think there is a lot of late round talent at the CB position with Thurmond out of Oregon and Wilson from Bosie amongst others.
Thoughts on this big_jay? I love draft talk so keep it coming.
I'm thinking NT
We have Fox at LB already, so we’re covered there.
I’m not ready to draft another CB until I see what we have with Burnett (who I thought played well Thursday) and K Lewis. Ike is going to bounce back, and Gay should make the switch to safety, which seems a more natural fit for him anyway.
OT I think we’re good with, despite Thursday night (I felt at least 6 of the sacks were on BB for forgetting how to throw the ball away). They’ve played much better this year, and the back ups look promising (at least to me). Foster, the returning Stapleton, and Urbrik seem to make us pretty deep. Still have no idea about T Hills though. Unless there is a super-stud ready to go – not usually still around 12-20, then not OL.
DE’s we seem to have some new depth with Ziggy and S. Harris; Aaron Smith returning, hang onto Eason….
NT is key, especially if Hampton is allowed to walk. The D is predicated on the line, even if it’s a thankless job. They clog it up against the run so the LB’s get free to make the tackle; clog it up agains the pass, again to make the LB’s shine. And let’s be honest, the solid line play and pressure from the LB’s make our secondary, even without Troy, look that much better since they have a shorter amount of time to defend against the pass.
Best Athlete Available
In a position we need: My top-3 needs Defensive Line, CB and Offensive Line. The OL is getting better, but they still need help as we saw in Cleveland.
we wouldn't be havin' this
i ‘ve said several times in theese pages that i’ would have pulled a mike ditka in 06 and traded all the picks except the compensatory for mario williams,,,,,,taha ha ha ,,,,,
then linebackers the next yr. i thought woodley would be better inside to move out potsy, and timmons better on the outside to “rush the passer” then add fox .
and i was shocked we didn’t resign mcfadden ……
with all that done, in this yrs draft we could trsde up again to get one of those miracle free safetys to track down any one who may escape from a rare bad polomalu gamble,,,,,,, i t hinnk thats what anthony smith was supposed to do,,,,,,i saw him make a ltteral handful of touchdown saving tackles for syracuse against wvu’s white and slaton over a 2 yr. period , b ut he traumatised himself so we still need a free safety to do just that, cover disaster if a troy gamble misses……..
our rebuilding would have already been done and no one would ever have noticed that this current deefense can’t stand on its own without lebeau blitzes, troys magic and offensive gifts of field position, time of possesion, a lead, and dicks micro managment.
totally agree with timmons/woodley!
woodley should be inside and timmons, off the edge!
by nycsteelerfan on Dec 13, 2009 8:34 AM EST up reply actions
I disagree
Woodley has been fine off the edge. I don’t see him being as effective on the inside, when you take away his best oppurtunity and doing what he does best: rushing the passer.
BTSC Obituaries
OldManSteeler, ominously died two days before Superbowl 123 where the Ravens are set to attempt their 7th superbowl win, facing the Detroit Lions on Sunday. He was 86. His last words are believed to be "MALOR CAN SUCK IT!!!". Like friends and family, we can only guess what this could mean.
by Tim Mullhaupt (HSS) on Dec 13, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
yep
Woodley’s main asset is being an outside edge rusher, you basically lose what makes him special when you move him inside. And it seems like Timmons is great at rushing the passer up the middle whenever we send him on a blitz, so I don’t see why this move would make sense.
woodley's
been great off the edge,,, better than i ever expected when he was a rookie and i first wonderd if he could play inside,,,,,,but we don’t KNOW how he’d do inside anymore than we know how hardy knickerson would have been outside instead os jason gildon or kevin green…….but next comment down
I would think this is honestly one of those drafts in which we could take the BPA (so long as it’s not a QB, TE, WR, or RB) in the first round. Of course, we have some flexibility to take the best CB or ILB in the draft – both positions of need – by trading up a spot or two (which shouldn’t cost us all that much).
Personally, Alabama’s ILB Ronaldo McClain is somebody i would love to snag. He already plays in a 3-4 and has all the physical attributes necessary to be a beast of an LB. He also has the kind of fire and on the field leadership skills that this D desperately needs. He reminds me a bit of Patrick Willis – which is maybe the highest compliment you can give an MLB today.
There are certainly good MLB’s available later in the draft (my boy Micha Johnson for one), but our first pick should be a difference maker, someone who could take over a game through sheer force of will. ILB isn’t our greatest position of need, but could we really pass up on a gamer like this guy if given the chance.
by BluegrassSteeler on Dec 13, 2009 1:47 AM EST reply actions
Why would you want to move Woodley to the inside? I don’t follow the logic here. What Woodley does is rush the passer and make plays in the backfield. Put him inside and he has to do a lot more in pass coverage which I don’t think he does all that well. He doesn’t exactly have the speed to stick with RB or a quick TE. Timmons is better suited inside although his pass coverage isn’t where it needs to be.
because its been necessary
first off i wanted to do this when he was a rookie before he showed what he could do from the edge . he had the reputation af a strong brutal tackler and run stopper…..potsy has never been our traditional middle mold of lambert, little, levon ,,,hardy, the hit man and as a rookie timmons was picked to play the outside,,,,,its nice to talk about getting lucky in the draft but look how much we need to fill,,,,,,this dee has been figured out, we’ve got to make best use of what we have,,,,,,,,and drafts are a lottery
Timmons outside?
Love to see timmons blitz, but I don’t think he is strong enough to hold the point of attack as OLB.
I think Timmons would excel at any LB position (obviously I don’t buy the criticism that he’s not big enough to hold the point), but if you move him outside what do you do with Harrison and Woodley? Surely you don’t take them off the field in an obvious passing situation.
by BluegrassSteeler on Dec 13, 2009 11:57 AM EST up reply actions
Gotta be in the Secondary FS or CB
Earl Thomas, Joe Haden, Trevard Lindley, Ras-I Dowling. or Morgan Burnett.
Alternatives could be Dan Williams (NT), Rolando McClain (ILB), Bryan Bulaga (OT).
Also depends on how many of those guys I listed above declare. Only 2 are seniors.
BTSC Obituaries
OldManSteeler, ominously died two days before Superbowl 123 where the Ravens are set to attempt their 7th superbowl win, facing the Detroit Lions on Sunday. He was 86. His last words are believed to be "MALOR CAN SUCK IT!!!". Like friends and family, we can only guess what this could mean.
by Tim Mullhaupt (HSS) on Dec 13, 2009 11:39 AM EST reply actions
A little late and in hind-sight
i wish we’d taken Rey Malaluaga. He’s a freaking monster. And the effing Bengals got him, to top it off…
I know he got in some trouble in college, but he was a hi-character guy in the locker room, and we sure coulda used another wild-eyed islander this year. Especially considering our lack of LB depth and Timmons’ up and down play.
As for next year- i say we go big for a shut-down corner or two. A lot of our trouble starts in the defensive backfield.
me to tobiathian,,,,,
thats what scared me about the bengals this yr,,,, i’m watchin the draft and fantisyzin that we could get lucky on a couple picks that i loved that were speculated to drop,,, maluega and that big fat tackle from alabama. cincy ate my lunch on both of them,,,,and i took it as a bad omen.
CB and FS
We need far more aggressive corners, given the new nature of the NFL’s pass-happy policies. And- safety’s need to be more like CBs than like quicker LBers(as in the “old days” of the league).
A lot of folks think that our front seven are slacking, but our middle- and deep-coverage is what’s really failing us. Our inability to stop the long-ball or create INTs is a critical point in our defensive issues. The corners we have now can cover, but they don’t play the ball and aggressively seek to take passes away from opponents. Ball-hawking secondaries create dominating defenses nowadays.
That’s why our D looks so weak without Troy: he’s a true go-getter, not a passive defender like Ike and Gay. Ryan Clark IS a ball-hawk, but hasn’t played well of late.
Pretty much all NFL defenses can run-stop now; it’s the defenses that gobble up interceptions and befuddle the passing game that rack up the sacks and turnovers.
We need big, tough, cocky DBs.
so we need a combonation of Neon Deon and Carnell Lake, I like it
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel and Chris Carter
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 13, 2009 6:29 PM EST up reply actions
Be glad you're not Mel Kiper
he sux
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
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