Locker Room Issues
by Piratefan13 on Dec 14, 2009 1:27 PM EST
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I wanted to open a discussion about these alleged "locker room issues" where Big Ben is supposedly not very popular. This is the first I've heard about this whole BS and I am wondering if anyone has some insight. I've been going on and on to my work mates about how "tight" the Steelers unit is on a daily basis and how its the way of things in Pittsburgh. Then Hines jumps out on National TV and throws down the gauntlet on Big Ben. I must admit, I sat there dumbfounded (jaw completely unhinged), I had really never heard anyone say anything even remotely as incindiary as "the locker room is 50-50," what the heck was all that? I used to really love Hines Ward, but after that I lost a ton of respect for him and even questioned his (what I believe) selfishness in playing the Browns game. Ward was clearly suffering from the hamstring and essentially hurt our chances in the game because he just couldn't get open. I believe he is certainly looking behind him on the depth chart and realizing that if Wallace could clean up his route running, Ward would be sitting. But, I digress, I am in total shock about this locker room mess and I am hoping that someone knows what is really going on and could explain how it got to this point.
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Hines is selfish?
Hines Ward:
Spent most of his career blocking, in a predominately run oriented offense
One of the best, if not the best, all around receivers in the NFL
Future Hall of Fame player
Played against the Browns, with a pulled hamstring, in a must-win-game for a playoff berth
Selfish? Who was going to take his place, Sweed?
Soon, he will retire, and we will miss him, like we do Jerome.
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 14, 2009 2:18 PM EST reply actions
Thats exactly my point
Don’t try to paint me a Ward hater… I love the guy, but him playing on an extremely cold night with a bad hamstring was not the best scenerio. Do you think he should have played? What impact did he really have?
I’m not trying to paint you at all. Merely responding to the part of your post that I take exception to.
Agreed, him playing with a bad hamstring was not the best scenario.
Do I think Ward should have played? Not if it held back someone else from playing, that would have given us a better chance to win.
What Impact did he really have? Hines is a team captain, a role model for the younger players, and an example of how to play “Steelers football”. I think his message was clearly: don’t quit.
Far from selfish.
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 14, 2009 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
+1
Who did Ward take catches from?
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 14, 2009 6:51 PM EST up reply actions
Ben, trick question?
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 14, 2009 8:36 PM EST up reply actions
Hines is one of the most unselfish players in the NFL
Always “we” never “I”. He made a huge mistake in judgement even entertaining the question from Costas about how anyone in the locker room feels about Ben. He manned up and apologized. I respect him even more for that. Hines has never quit on this team and I don’t foresee him doing it now. He’s a solid player and a class act as a Steeler.
When the tailgate drops, the BS stops. Shut up and play!
I agree.
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 15, 2009 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
There is a difference...
between being a tough guy and being selfish. I love the fact that Ward has done everything imaginable for the Steelers over his career, but that all gets forgotten the moment he makes a stupid statement like he did to Bob Costas. We can all deny it and say it was blown out of porportion, but frankly, what was said, was said. I am a believer in “where there is smoke, there is fire.”
I believe that part of his decision to play Thursday night was based on the fact that he called Big Ben a sissy and that he didn’t want to be viewed as one for having “just a hamstring pull.” I can see Ward playing on a warmer afternoon, but the situation for him to play Thursday night was the worst possible there could have been. He was noticeably slow (even noticed by the announcers), and Ward isn’t all that fast to begin with, so he wasn’t getting much separation (if any).
Let me clarify, I am a huge fan of Hines Ward and am glad that he is signed to retire a Steeler, but I don’t think he should have played Thursday night. It was admirable for him to give it a try, but unfortunately it was a very unsuccessful night. Tomlin is responsible for that decision.
Now I have read comments that Wallace didn’t do much better, but don’t you think that could be because the coverage could roll more towards Wallace and Tone considering Ward was hobbled and required less attention? Additionally there has been mention that we don’t have anyone that could have replaced Ward. I say, that’s not an excuse, a championship team has depth and when starters go out, other players step up. That is why we should have put Sweed out there and given him an opportunity. In hindsight, could he have done any worse?
I am a huge supporter of Tomlin, but on this night, we didn’t get his best. It happens to everyone, but in a must win situation against a long-time rival, it was a must.
I think there are a lot of assumptions in your post.
I’m not so sure he played because of what happened with Ben. It would be a really big loss for this team to lose him and I’m pretty sure some BS interview wouldn’t be the driving force behind him playing. Sure Ben was hurt by the comments. I’d have been hurt by them too! That’s not what you expect from your teammate… especially Hines Ward. I think Hines played because he felt well enough TO play.
When the tailgate drops, the BS stops. Shut up and play!
I agree, Hines should have been limited in play time
This is where the HC must address the needs of the team vs the desire of an individual to play. I love Hines Ward, in my top 5 all time of any football player I’ve ever seen in the NFL. That said, his ability to help the team was very questionable before the game. After the game got going it became pretty obvious that he couldn’t play fast enough to make a positive impact.
Can’t wait for the comments about me being disloyal or a bandwagon fan to start flying here as well.
"Franz" in NoCal
Watch the interview again
It got blown out of proportion, big time. He was straight up about his thoughts on playing with injuries. He didn’t have a call out Ben press conference. He apoligized to BB over the untimely nature of the interview…if Ben’s not mad at him, should you be mad? As far as him being selfish, can’t agree there either, but that’s your opinion and you may run with it.
"Now that I'm here, I don't want to just be here, I want to be here for a long time." Hines Ward, 1998 4th round draft pick.
by kick him in the head on Dec 14, 2009 3:27 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
+1
Winning solves everything, losing makes minor issues into major ones.
Agreed that Hines’ comments were sensationalized. The HC inadvertently made Ben playing into an issue by not informing his team what was going on. Nevertheless, there does seem to be some resentment of Ben in the locker room. Go back and read Santonio’s comments after the 2nd Bengals game when Ben said he was out of sorts and could never find his rhythm. Santonio didn’t try to bale him out, he basically said “well, that’s on him then.” Still, none of this would be a problem is we were winning.
The interview was ...
… at worst careless rather than malicious of Ward, He needed to be careful and specific in his comments and he wasn’t, allowing for sensational interpretations to be taken.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 14, 2009 6:58 PM EST up reply actions
I was just going to say...
in my opinion, Hines didnt say anything that Ben or anyone esle should have taken offense to. He said the locker room was 50/50 about Ben not playing, he didnt call out Bens toughness or anything like that. The way I took it he said, some people will lie about injuries, some dont. I definitley feel it was blown way out of proportion
by indianasteelers on Dec 15, 2009 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
it’s not like wallace was getting open when HE was out there so Hines definitely helped out our team by playing. gotta look at who’s replacing him and what he could’ve/did do and frankly a hines with a tweaked hammy was better than a healthy mike wallace that night.
it was wrong what hines did, but he’s since apologized to the them and ben. everything else is just rumors (maybe or maybe not baseless). and those 2 should have moved on by now.
I have no idea whether it is true or not, but I’ve heard rumors since he was a rookie that his was not popular among other Steelers. Typically, they surface when the players MVP has been named and it has never been Ben. There were also reports that some of the unhappiness with Ben before the Baltimore game was due a comment by Ben to his teammates that whether it was intended that way or not, was taken by his teammates that they would have to be extraordinarily lucky to win without him in the lineup.
Also don’t want to forget what Alan Faneca said after Tommy Gun got hurt at Baltimore. It was pretty clear he wasn’t a fan of Ben at all.
Look, it’s 53 different people. It’s not possible for everybody to be best friends. I’ve heard Jack Ham admit that even when they were winning, there guys he couldn’t stand. I’m inclined to believe that as much as it’s been mentioned, there is probably some truth to it. I’ve also heard that Bradshaw wasn’t very well liked either. But hey, they’ve won a lot of big games and I expect that Ben still has quite a few more wins coming his way.
watching the 2008 America's Game made me not like Ben that much either.
he just seemed like a real cocky jackoff, excuse my language
I usually speak like a sailor, but I've noticed that cursing is usually taboo on here in most situations
so I try to clean it the fuck up
I think that the problem with cursing
is that it so often substitutes for rational thought. Some of the other fansites seem to have numerous posts that look rather like the old cartoon #$^#$. I’m a person who prefers a relatively expletive-free environment, but I don’t mind reading through the occasional heart-felt bit of emphasis (or even self-consciously amusing usage, as above.) But my observation has been that in general, the more profanity in a post, the less thought has gone into it. Frankly, I would rather not waste my time reading someone’s stream-of-consciousness cathartic experience. I realize that this site is not in existence to cater to my whims, but I did appreciate finding one that I can enjoy. And thanks to you all for helping to keep it that way…
"The standard of expectation does not change." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Dec 15, 2009 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
I always thought most starting NFL QB's were cocky
Who cares? As long as they deliver on the field.
"In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women."
Tony Montana- Scarface
I watched that too
I remember them saying that Charlie Batch had to have a sit-down with Ben because BB wasn’t being a good teammate. BB seemed like a little kid who got to realize his dreams.
Polamalu was amazing in that piece. And Tomlin’s “Sticky Lombardi” comment cracked me up.
I love being the most-hated guy here. I love beating them while [their fans] are flicking me off. --Hines Ward
You are referring to 2 different shows on 2 different stations
The Charlie Batch interview was on ESPN where he was referring to the old BB. Polamalu, Ben and Tomlin were interviewed for the America’s Game piece.
"In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women."
Tony Montana- Scarface
No... I only watched America's game and did not see a separate ESPN Batch interview
I love being the most-hated guy here. I love beating them while [their fans] are flicking me off. --Hines Ward
I think....
Either way…
I love being the most-hated guy here. I love beating them while [their fans] are flicking me off. --Hines Ward
THis quote:
that they would have to be extraordinarily lucky to win without him in the lineup.
This is the second time I’ve seen this posted, where is it coming from?
Also, Ben seemed very supportive of Dixon during the game and Dixon seemed to welcoming and receptive to the effort.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 14, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions
I heard this story on ESPN 1250 a day or two after the Baltimore game. Supposedly, after Ben was told he was not going to play in the Baltimore game, he walked through the locker room, and supposedly said, Good luck winning without me. I’d didn’t put quotes because I have no clue whether it’s true, just what I heard from a radio station.
by Silverback92 on Dec 14, 2009 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
I don't believe half of what people supposedly "know"
Sounds like someone wants to be a shit-stirrer to me… Just sayin’
When the tailgate drops, the BS stops. Shut up and play!
Just citing where I first heard this rumor.
by Silverback92 on Dec 15, 2009 9:05 AM EST up reply actions
Wow if Ben saying something like that to cause a stir in the locker room that ESPN radio is reporting
some of those guys might be a little to sensitive. If he did say something like that I don’t think it was a dig at Dennis Dixon as much as it was a fact that the starting qb wasn’t going to be in the game. I hope none of this split locker room crap is untrue because I have always loved the Steelers because of their team unity and it would be a real shame to have high school drama team this team apart.
"In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women."
Tony Montana- Scarface
So you hope it's true?
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
I like to hold out hope
I just don’t want them to turn into the Dallas Cowboys with all this drama. Deion Sanders pretty much tore that locker room apart when he played for them in the 90’s.
"In this country, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the women."
Tony Montana- Scarface
Ok
just asking…
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
by PixburghArn on Dec 15, 2009 12:28 PM EST up reply actions
I'm not sure
that she followed the negative trail to its logical conclusion, unlike a certain smartass of my virtual acquaintance.
"The standard of expectation does not change." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Dec 15, 2009 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
Would that be you?
because you so eagerly pointed it out. just sayin…. :)
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
touché
"The standard of expectation does not change." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Dec 15, 2009 3:27 PM EST up reply actions
Great minds think alike
I know….you don’t like that comparison…lol
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
I'm flattered, actually
"The standard of expectation does not change." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Dec 15, 2009 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
you're too kind
I’m fattered that you’re flattered
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
deion sanders yells like gilbert godfrey
when he’s only saying the most pedestrian of sentences. it really grates on me
he has turrets
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
what did faneca say about BB??
please enlighten me..
by nycsteelerfan on Dec 16, 2009 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
Every locker room has drama
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
The offense never seemed to have much chemistry
On or off the field. There is an oft aired clip from last year’s Super Bowl where Hines was preaching to "Tone. This was frequently held up as an example as Hines as a mentor but I found Hines looked like more of a blowhard. "Tone was just ignoring Hines while Hines lectured him. I would ignore him too, if I was having one of the best games of my life and some old dude was telling me “this is my opportunity.”
Willie Parker complaints last year? Hines’ complaints this year? Ben’s constant grimacing and shoulder shrugging everytime he is sacked? The O line was so bad with on field chemistry last year it is hard to imagine they had any off the field chemistry.
The defense was tight and operated as a single unit last year. No doubt, there was unparalleled chemistry on that unit. I don’t know that there was ever that sort of camaraderie on the offense, but there certainly isn’t now.
by CarlWeathersMustache on Dec 15, 2009 10:39 AM EST reply actions
Every team I have coached
at every level, of course not pro there is always more discontent on the offensive side of the ball. I do have friends and family that have played and/or coached pro and they say the same. My opinion is defense is more reliant on the team concept than offense. The object of the offense is to score. There is a goal of points and noteriety. On defense we have to work as a unti to stop someone. It doesn’t matter who stops them…we just have to. Sure there must be some cohesiveness but outside of the offensive line it’s not crucial. Highly desirable but not crucial. Just my observation/opinion.
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
by PixburghArn on Dec 15, 2009 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
You don't want to start into offense vs. defense.
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
unless you're Raw Lewis
and then you’re the God of football and no offense putting up less than 30 points is enough to stop your discontent and whining at press conferences. I’m glad their D has been pretty mortal this year
There are definite exceptions my brutha
"A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty." - Winston Churchill
On a team everyone doesn't always gets along and sometime you say dumb stuff
so this just a case of Losing + frustration = dumb stuff being said thats it, this sort of stuff happens all the time so the guys will work through it
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel and Chris Carter
When you lose, nothing really helps with the locker room situation.
Ever notice how the perennial losers (not mentioning any names) always seem to have the most locker room issues?
any team with TO on it
or the browns or the December Cowboys
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame
DIck Lebeau, Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel and Chris Carter
by WVPiratesfan on Dec 15, 2009 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
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