Latest Steelers Loss Leaves Fans Wondering
by Michael Bean on Dec 7, 2009 5:29 AM EST
194 comments
Some more comprehensive thoughts about the Steelers 24-27 loss on Sunday at home to the Oakland Raiders. As always, they're mostly rambling in nature, a combination of both positive and negative thoughts, and contextualized within a broader framework of the realities of life in the National Football League since the historic 1993 Collective Bargaining Agreement.
* One of the beautiful things about the National Football League is just how much of a team game it really is. You can't really win in this league with just one, or even two or three outstanding players if the rest of the roster is average to below average. You need depth to win, even in years when the injury bug doesn't strike. And when players do go down, which happens most every year, you need to have adequate backups ready to fill in and contribute. Where am I going with this? Well, just a few prefacing thoughts about how I'm perfectly aware that the Steelers struggles can't be attributed solely to the absence of Troy Polamalu on defense. But it's pretty telling just how differently this defense has performed with and without #43 in the lineup. Here are some of the more telling figures:
Record: With Polamalu, 4-1....Without Polamalu, 2-5
Points per Game Allowed: With Polamalu13.8....Without Polamalu, 23.1
TD passes allowed: With Polamalu, 2.... Without Polamalu, 13
Interceptions: With Polamalu, 7....Without Polamalu,1
Takeaways: With Polamalu, 11...Without Polamalu, 5
Now, going back to my original statement about football and the NFL in particular are interesting - almost every play requires the small and often unnoticeable contributions of multiple guys for things to work out as designed. That can be said of both offensive and defensive plays. A successful play requires more than just the guys throwing and catching the balls; and on defense, the defender who defends the pass or makes the tackle. It's impossible for us to see everything unfold from the angles provided on television broadcasts. But as fans and 'students' of the game, we understand this reality without necessarily understanding why or how all the disparate parts on an NFL field work together to make up what happens each play, series, game, and season. A couple of obvious examples are how the Steelers rush defense is predicated on Aaron Smith, Brett Keisel and Casey Hampton clogging the gaps in the interior so that teammates behind them can clean up and make a play. Their unheralded work ensures that offensive linemen can't get anywhere close to the next level to get a hat on our LBs and DBs to open up even bigger plays in the running game. On the other side of the ball, plays like those bubble screens to Santonio Holmes require Heath Miller and/or Hines Ward to get a necessary block on a cornerback so that Holmes has a bit of operating room to work with initially after the catch. Without the blocks, the plays are gobbled up for zero or negative yardage. With the right blocks Holmes looks like a baller after the catch.
Said differently, unlike baseball games which are essentially a multitude of 1-on-1 confrontations for the most part (pitcher vs. batter), or basketball games, which often times (at least in the NBA) are decided by which team has the best individual player with the most unguardable 1-on-1 moves, NFL contests are generally speaking more decidedly determined by subtle actions/contributions from players not directly involved in the outcome of specific plays.
What's my point? Well, I guess I'm trying to say that it's not exactly clear how Polamalu may or may not make his teammates in the secondary better. I wish it was more easily quantifiable or even identifiable. There are some nascent statistical outfits that are trying to do things like this..i.e. measure the value of particular players in ways beyond just the traditional statistical metrics like tackles, INTs, yards, etc. But for the most part, we're still all largely uneducated - or at least ill-equipped with the necessary viewing angles - to better understand how all 11 guys on each side of the ball work together most plays.
Anyway, I'm admitting that I can't 'prove' it in any legitimately cogent way, but I really have to believe that Polamalu makes guys like Ryan Clark, Ike Taylor, Lawrence Timmons, James Farrior and Deshea Townsend much better than they otherwise are.
Unfortunately for the Steelers, that doesn't really cut it in today's NFL. This is a discussion for another day, but I suppose the only solution really is to retool the roster some this spring and summer so that the team is not so heavily dependent on #43's presence.
* I said it last week and I'll say it once more...even though it pains me to do so. The Steelers will be better off in 2010 and beyond because of the growing pains that their youngsters are going through this year. William Gay, Ryan Mundy, Joe Burnett, Ziggy Hood, Stefan Logan - all these guys will be better because of all the experience they're accumulating this year. The Steelers don't overspend in free agency - sometimes that may be to their disadvantage, which I wrote all summer I thought was the case with Bryant McFadden (mostly because he wasn't expensive, or over the hill age-wise). What the Steelers do instead is build through the draft, develop their young talent, and position themselves nicely to make repeated runs at Super Bowls every so often when their draft classes that are particularly strong get the requisite seasoning and experience.
I wrote this earlier in the year before it was apparent just how much this year's team would struggle:
I just wanted to throw this discussion starter out there to see what some of you guys thought - are the Steelers making more little mistakes early on in the 2009 season because they are working in a high volume of rookies compared to in years past? It's fairly well documented that rookies don't often see the field much during their first season in Pittsburgh. There have been exceptions, for sure, but for the most part, players are forced to learn the ropes for a year or two behind more seasoned, veteran players before getting their first real crack at making an impact for the Black 'n Gold.
Again, I'm not really pointing to specific plays or instances where the 2009 Steelers rookie class has cost the team. I'm just making a general point that the team is working in far more young bodies than we are accustomed to. This will pay dividends for the organization down the road, and perhaps even for this team later on in the 2009 season. There will be more growing pains though I'd guess before things really all start to come together for this particular squad. That's part of the process and the reality of life in the National Football League. As fans, we must be both excited about all the fresh talent in the pipeline while also remaining realistic about the growing curve that these young players must face and overcome before consistently contributing to a ballclub with championship aspirations.
Well, a couple months and four more losses later, we're seeing the Steelers rookies as well as the second year players (but first year starters) make easily identifiable and costly mistakes that are costing this team ball games. I'll stick with my guns though - it's going to make this team better down the road. Questioning the talent evaluation abilities of Kevin Colbert and his army of scouts is simply ridiculous given their track record. We, as fans, must just wait for much of this young talent to 'grow up' a bit in this insanely competitive and pressure-packed league.
* Case in point - Joe Burnett's total whiff of a game-clinching interception on the Raiders final drive. Not even going to bag on Burnett for the gaffe. The kid's a proven ball-hawk and sure-handed defensive back from his college days. And hell, junior varsity high school players across our great country make that catch every Friday night. Burnett muffed it under the pressure of sealing a W for his reeling team.
* Finally a big play contribution from KR/PR Stefan Logan. Kudos to him for hanging in there and continuing to run hard after what I imagine has been somewhat of a frustrating season for him personally. Again, not like he's been bad by any stretch of the imagination. I just figure he probably had higher expectations for himself coming out of training camp and the preseason. His 83 yard return on the game's opening kickoff put the Steelers in prime position to jump out to an early 7-0 lead. Perhaps foreshadowing what was to come for the Steelers in the redzone, Pittsburgh had to settle for 3 points after going pass, run, pass and picking up just 4 yards.
* Ike Taylor got the flack for allowing several big plays on Sunday, and once again, the criticism is essentially deserved. But let me quickly talk about the heave Gradkowski threw to Lois Murphy on the game-winning drive - the lobbed, lame duck throw that Murphy rose up to and snagged away from Taylor that gave the Raiders reason to believe they could actually pull it out. Well, re-watch that play and noticed what Deshea Townsend contributed on that play. Um, nothing. We don't expect Deshea to be a head hunter in the running game or to lay the wood frequently in the dime and nickel packages he plays in. But we do expect the savvy veteran to show a good sense...a veteran sense...of how to locate a desperation heave like that with multiple teammates surrounding him. Not sure what's going on with one of the more important Steelers defenders this decade but whatever it is, it's not good. In fact, it may be hurting the team more than anybody's really talking about. Just think how important he was last year in important moments when teams were trying to come from behind. Disappointing stuff.
* On a similar note...on the ensuing Raiders kickoff return, who was it returning the kick for Oakland but the one and only Gary Russell, last year's return man in Pittsburgh? Russell actually would return that kickoff 34 yards to put Oakland in business on their first offensive series of the game. The Raiders would convert a 4th and 1 from the Steelers 49 yard line before having to settle for a field goal of their own, a successful 48 yard boot from the mercurial Sebastian Janikowski.
Couple things about that opening sequence of drives. 1) I thought the Steelers offensive balance was just fine for the most part. How could you not really? Ben Roethlisberger threw the ball 24 times while the trio of Rashard Mendenhall, Willie Parker and Mewelde Moore had 24 combined carries. Still, on that first offensive series following the long Logan kickoff return, I would have liked to see the offense come out and prove they were ready to 'raise hell' on their remaining opponents by going to the running game early and often. Now, obviously a negative run on 2nd and 5 put the Steelers in a 'passing situation', but given how bad Oakland's rush defense is (31st in Y/G), and how legitimately decent they are against the pass (215.8 Y/G), I thought the Steelers could have stood to lean on the running game even more than they did all game. I'm usually one who's in favor of taking to the air if all relevant variables are equal, but I would say that this game was one where the team could have sacrificed some of the success they were having through the air to A) shorten the game knowing the team would be playing a few short days from Sunday...B) minimize the risk of Ben Roethlisberger taking unnecessary hits in the passing game...and C) get a win that resembled 'Steelers football'..i.e. a win that was done via smash mouth, not-always-pretty football.
Anyway, like I said, the balance was by no means awful today. It was just fine. On to Oakland's first sequence though. Loved the play call on 3rd and 10 when they opted to run with Justin Fargas rather than playing in to the Steelers hands and trying to throw the ball in the face of blitzing pressure. The result was a 9 yard gain that set up 4th and 1 from Pittsburgh's 49. Tom Cable aggressively went for it, even though a failed conversion risked putting his team down an early 6 or even worse yet, 10 points, on the road. It was a little discussed decision, but it actually somewhat set the tone for the rest of the game. Oakland was here to play.
* One other thought about that 4th down call from Oakland on their opening series, as well as how Pittsburgh defended it. Is it just me or have the Steelers too often over committed to stuffing the run in situations like that this year only to get beat on quick passes, screens, or flare outs on the perimeter that have left a linebacker on a speedier running back or bigger tight end? I say just let the defensive line + the outside linebackers + one of the safetys do their best to plug up the run and make sure that the ILBs + the CBs + the other safety are all 100% prepared for something happening on the perimeter. On the Raiders successful 4th down conversion, Lawrence Timmons and Tyrone Carter were a step behind the play - a 10 yard pitch and catch to Justin Fargas.
* Speaking of the rush defense, the Steelers still sport the league's best rush defense through 12 games, and it's next to impossible that either Green Bay (currently 4th) or Baltimore (6th) surpasses them after MNF tomorrow. Pittsburgh has allowed just 77.8 yards per game, but have given up 100 yard games for consecutive weeks now, and have allowed their opponent to surpass the century mark four times through 12 games. By comparison, last year's defense only allowed 100+ rushing yards in a game four times all season. That's not to say the rush defense has been horrid this year, or for that matter even significantly worse, but there nevertheless has been a dropoff.
* I try not to 'speak' in a hyperbolic nature very often, but I will say that I think Ryan Mundy will never be worthy of a starting spot in a Pittsburgh Steelers secondary. Mundy was awful down the stretch on Sunday. His unnecessary roughness hit on the Raiders' game-winning drive was I suppose somewhat questionable, but it also wasn't very smart any way you cut it. At worst, you have to make sure you're not delivering a helmet-to-helmet hit there. I've had plenty of issues with the way Ryan Clark has played this year, but to his credit, one thing he never does is lead with his helmet on those big hits he tries (sometimes too often) to deliver on would be receivers over the middle. He instead leads with his shoulder which (thankfully) rarely, if ever, gets called in this league. Helmet-to-helmet hits do get called though, particularly in today's game. Not smart. Then, to get beat cheating up on Zack Miller, the Raiders tight end on the game-winning touchdown is equally inexcusable. I didn't like the decision to send a corner blitz there at all, but it was called, and Munday and the other safety in the game (Clark, I believe) were asked to handle pass-coverage responsibilities alongside a few linebackers in place of the blitzing CBs. Well, Mundy didn't play as if he had concrete coverage responsibilities and allowed Lois Murphy to break free of him for the touchdown reception.
* I have to hand it to Bruce Gradkowski for his performance on Sunday, but in particular for that game-winning TD throw to Murphy. That was a perfectly thrown ball with his feet not set as Brett Keisel was bearing down in his face and throwing window. As I was watching that final play, I said 'ballgame' before the ball was thrown but after it was apparent the blitzing Steelers were not going to get to Gradkowski as was designed.
* I've seen some people criticizing the Steelers offensive line for their performance on Sunday, but I don't at all agree with that assessment. Though the majority of Rashard Mendenhall's 103 yards came on a 60 yard run in the 1st quarter, the Steelers offensive line still did some nice things in both the running and passing game. Big Ben was sacked just once and had time to throw much of the afternoon. They weren't dominant, but we never really though they would be, even against some of the weaker defensive lines in the league. They continued though to hold their own and not be responsible for the team's troubles, which of course could be said of them last year.
* I'll be doing my usual weekly league-wide musings soon enough, but I will say this for now - root like hell for Green Bay tomorrow night when they host the visiting Baltimore Ravens. With Denver and Jacksonville winning on Sunday, the Steelers could benefit from a Ravens loss. There are plenty of Steelers fans who have written off this year, and I suppose I can't blame them. It's been awfully frustrating and disappointing to see professionals perform like this. I myself am not making any predictions about this team anymore because they have proven too often that they can play great yet find new and amazing ways to lose games. But I will say this - one of the immensely fun and captivating aspects of being an NFL fan is dissecting each and every way that our favorite team can sneak in to the playoffs provided X, Y, Z happens.
Don't get me wrong, the teams that are relegated to league-wide 'scoreboard watching' down the stretch usually...scratch that, almost always....get bounced in the 1st round of the playoffs. That's not the point though. You can't win it ever year. At best, you just hope that there's any reason at all to tune in to watch your favorite team play come the final month of the season other than simply because that's what you do for 16 weeks each fall and winter.
The 2009 Pittsburgh Steelers - despite their myriad flaws, frustrating tendencies, and seemingly certain fate as a non-contender for the Lombardi Trophy - still are more than mathematically still in it with four games to go. You won't hear any such sentiments or reflections from me if the Steelers were to lose at Cleveland on Thursday. And that's not just because they'd probably be very, very close to mathematically out of it were they to lose. It's also because the defending champs just best not lose to the lowly Browns following four straight losses (at least 3 or which they definitely should have won).
I say that even though the game's on the road and even though I'm as big a proponent as anybody for tempering annual expectations in this league due to how the league's been systematically structured in the 1993 Collective Bargaining Agreement and the subsequent revisions to it since then - that is to say that it's nothing novel or historic to see a defending champion like the Steelers - with seemingly top 10 talent on both sides of the ball - struggle or look little like the team that had won it all the previous year. It's frustrating and it's easy to point the finger, but unless you have a the greatest quarterback in the history of this league, Peyton Manning, you're going to endure some serious peaks and valleys over the years as a result of the way this league has been structured to promote ridiculously competitive games and playoff races every year. Without a robotically efficient and perfectly groomed QB like Manning guiding your team over the years, your team's just not going to be able to sustain the effects of injuries, bad luck, poor defense some weeks/years, bad coaching, etc, etc, etc to win consistently. We're seeing that with New England in recent years; we're seeing it with Pittsburgh this year and in 2006; we've seen it with New Orleans in 2007 and 2008 following their run to the NFC Title Game in Brees' first year. Some years things come together perfectly - which is what we may be seeing in both New Orleans and Indianapolis. Other years very good rosters somehow find little ways to miss out on opportunities to build something special as a group. The Steelers most certainly seem to be in one of those seriously annoying down years where that's the case.
BUT, as Lloyd Christmas once said, 'so you're saying there's a chance?'
Yes, for at least another week, yes there is. And for that I'm still grateful and excited, no matter how let down and disappointed I continue to feel come the end of too many weekends this fall.
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Mundy
The league will be using Mundy’s helmet-to-helmet hit as the picturesque example of when to throw a flag. Extremely poor technique on his part. Take the 15 yard penalty with the fact he knocked one of his teammates out with a similar hit, and I think it’s safe to say he was the least valuable Steelers player in the game.
As far as tangibly measuring Polamalu’s contributions, I’d go back to the concept of it being a team game. You’re as strong as your weakest link, and if the absence of one starter means the 12th or 13th or whatever defensive player on your roster has to be in the game, you’re that much less of a team.
Or, just look at the takeaway stat you posted. He had a pick in one half of action against Tennessee before he got hurt. When he finally returned, he had a pick in one of the first series of the game.
The defense basically didn’t force any other turnovers. He provides a level of measurable fear in opposing offenses, because he rushes the passer as well as he covers receivers and defends zones. He covers so much more ground than any of his teammates, he’s bound to make more plays than anyone else.
No team is better when their best player isn’t on the field. I’m not going to make excuses, but we’re probably a .500 team over the course of an entire season if he isn’t in there. His tackles-for-losses, interceptions, passes defensed and ability to F up blocking assignments is good for a few wins each year.
Steelers secondary without Troy is GARBAGE; 2 CBs, 1 FS needed in the upcoming draft
After rewatching that last drive in the highlights by the Raiders, there were 4 different occasions where Gradkowski just threw the ball up for grabs and the Steelers CBs didn’t make a play. The broadcasters doing the highlights on NFL.com joked that Troy would have had 4 ints. — just on that last drive alone! Other thoughts on the secondary:
— I thought the Steelers secondary a few years ago that had CBs DeWayne Washington and Chad Scott with safeties Myron Bell and Lee Flowers was one of the worst in this team’s history, the foursome of Gay, Ike, Gay, and Carter is giving them a run for their money.
— William Gay is a free safety that the Steelers are trying to get away with playing corner. He just doesn’t have the speed to run with NFL WR’s, that’s why he gives them so much cushion. I’d be willing to try him at free safety next year because I think he is a better player coming fwd than he is trying to backpedal, turn and run. At the very worst, if he isn’t a starting free safety, than he can be one of the 4 safeties that you keep on the roster because he and A. Madison were good special team players and awesome gunners a year ago.
— I think when Ike’s contract is up, I would probably let him walk. He just doesn’t make any plays on the ball and he doesn’t seem particularly interested in making a tackle when someone breaks out after the catch. The push against the sideline instead of trying to make a tackle was inexcusable for a player playing on a team that was facing a 4-game losing streak and fighting for their life. And this is the second week that he didn’t make a play on the ball during a jump ball situation (he whiffed on the Derrick Mason TD for the Ravens this past week too). It seems like doesn’t see the ball well enough to try and high point it or knock it away. I think he’s had one pick in the last two years (against Dallas this pat year), but someone can check that for me.
— The Steelers front office showed again why they are smarter than most of us here by not giving Ryan Clark that contract extension that everyone here wanted (including me). He has had the chance to make numerous plays this year and hasn’t, and his arrow is pointing downward. You can argue that Troy makes him better than what he is. In this D, you got to have a free safety that can limit the big plays, make plays on the ball and play sideline to sideline. The only thing that Clark is looking for now is just the big hit. He’s definitely lost a step and isn’t making the plays on the ball that need to be made.
— We will see what Deshea has left in the tank starting this Thursday because Gay isn’t playing with his concussion (let’s be honest, how many of you didn’t shed a tear when Gay went to the sidelines early after the horrible day that he had, slipping on four completions to the Raiders WR where he didn’t even make a play on the ball, it was sickening). Don’t want anyone to get hurt, but Gay needed to be sat down yesterday and if the coaching staff wouldn’t do it, at least the injury did. Deshea probably won’t be with the team next year. I think his role will be filled by Joe Burnett.
- Joe Burnett & K. Lewis - two unknown quantities to this point, although Burnett dropped that easy interception yesterday. I don’t blame the rookie too much because he at least got his hands on a pass, which is more than what Ike and Gay has done during this losing streak and most of the year. Burnett doesn’t have the speed to be a starting NFL corner. Did you guys see the cushion he was giving Raiders WR’s when he came in the game? It was more than what Gay usually gives up. I think he’ll be fine in Townsend’s role playing the slot WR. We don’t know much about Lewis, other than he is a big CB, 6’1’’, 208 lbs., that can’t run with WR Mike Wallace (how many CB’s can?). The development of these two players could have a big impact on next year’s secondary.
— Ryan Mundy admitted he was playing a different coverage on the 75-yard-TD pass that Ike didn’t try to make a tackle on. Tomlin said a safety blew the coverage (Mundy) and that Ike should have had inside technique instead of outside technique trailing the WR. Though Mundy stood out for all the wrong reasons yesterday, I think he has potential and should probably be one of the two backup safeties with Gay next year. I don’t blame Mundy for laying the wood on that WR at the goal line. Yes, it wasn’t a smart play, but he might not have seen the WR drop the ball and merely wanted to give a big hit to make sure he didn’t catch it. At least he was TRYING to make a play and competing, which is what our secondary didn’t do yesterday. And on that last play, you can’t expect a safety to win consistently against a WR one on one.
— Two free agent cornerbacks that the Steelers should look at who might be in their price range are Leigh Bodden and Ellis Hobbs. Bodden has good size, and I think the Steelers considered him this offseason. Hobbs is a very good kick returner and could play in the team’s dime D. Don’t know much about the free agent safeties.
— In the draft, I don’t know if the Steelers will have a chance at free safety Eric Berry from the Vols or CB Joe Haden from the Gators. But three names to keep an eye on in the secondary are CBs Perrish Cox from OSU, Jerome Murphy from South Florida and Brandon Ghee from Wake Forest. A potential first-round pick at safety, other than Berry, is S Earl Thomas from Texas. Cox has good size and is a KR/PR to boost. Ghee has good size and good speed. Murphy is a second or third round type that has good size and is an outstanding special teams tackler and hitter in general. Thomas is slightly undersized but is a playmaker at safety, someone who you could pair with Troy P. and have 2 playmakers at the safety position. Right now, I think the Steelers should be looking at Cox in the first round or NT/DT Dan Williams from the Vols. I actually would probably take him over Cody because Williams has the potential to play all 3 downs, being one of your inside rushers on 3rd down.
— Now that the OL is playing better, the team’s achilles heel is clearly the secondary right now. Clark and Tyrone Carter (hopefully the Steelers will finally let him go) have no speed and Ike and Gay can’t (or won’t) make plays on the ball. So offenses know if they can block up the pass rush, it’s easy pickings for them in our secondary without Troy P. Had to get this out of the system or have it eat at me for the rest of the morning.
by datruth4life on Dec 7, 2009 11:07 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Very interesting analysis....
…..I agree with most of it. I must admit I hadn’t thought of Gay as a free safety, worth consideration but I’d still draft a safety.
Mundy should be kept, he shouldn’t be roasted for the penalty, rookie(technically he’s not) error.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
like the comment about gay at FS
maybe we’d only need a CB in the draft then
also agree that Mundy’s heart was in the right place by lighting up the raiders WR. but his technique was bad by leading with his head and making helmet/helmet contact. he did it twice costing the a big penalty and injuring a fellow player making our already weak secondary weaker
Getting Gay off the field at CB made this team weaker?
Just asking. With his play recently, I don’t know about that one. You could say the same thing about Ike.
Good point about the cushion that Burnett was giving. I think it is worth noting that it makes sense to play it safe with a first-ever starting CB that was a 5th round pick. I don’t think he will typically play that far off.
However, it is also worth noting that Joe was always presumed to be drafted to be a nickel back. I would have expected Keenan to fill in at that spot, but he was on the sidelines. Lewis will be active this thursday, I’m sure, so we’ll have to keep an eye out and see what happens. I expect Burnett to be the dime back, Mundy shouldn’t see the field.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
Rec
That is datruth. I agree with all of your points. I remember at the beginning of the year thinking how bad the OL was and how there could not be much worse than having an OL like that. Damn was I wrong. A bad OL will give up sacks here and there and make it harder to run, but these can be overcame. On the other hand, a bad secondary is 30 times worse. When you cannot stop the other team late, you are not going to win many games. If I was an OC going against us, I’d throw deep at least once every 3 downs. I probably wouldn’t run the ball until I thought the Steelers D was not being honest.
This draft may be one of the most important ones I have ever seen as a Steelers fan. We have a lot of potential on offense and defense, but we are missing a few key players. This team has a lot of potential on it, but it is missing a few components to make it dominant and a real SB contender. We really need to do something at CB, ILB (not sure how I feel about Fox being a full time starter), do something with safety, and possibly draft a NT early. With the right moves and right selections we could easily compete for #7.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
Everyone in steelers fandom (myself, included) wanted us to draft O-line. Now everyone wants the steelers to draft secondary help…Fortunately for us, the steelers staff is a lot smarter than its fans, and drafted two cornerbacks last year before anyone thought it was necessary. We’re getting up in arms about drafting secondary when two picks were put in last year for it. Two picks that could very well work out. I suggest that we stop pining for new cornerbacks until we see what Taylor-Lewis-Townsend-Burnett can do, and especially what Taylor-Lewis-Gay-Burnett can do, because I think we will all be surprised. Further, I expect that Lewis and Burnett will each improve during the end of the season, off-season, and at least one of them will be pretty good next year.
As usual, the steelers will roll into next season with no holes to fill.
They need a DT, Hampton isn’t going to last forever. If a top-tier DT falls or steelers are in a good draft position, get him.
They need a DE, but not in the first round this year.
They need ILB. Farrior is on the slide and ILBs can’t step in immediately for this system.
They need OLB. Harrison and Woodley are machines, but need backups…especially Harriosn. Probably not a first round need.
They need a CB. If a good guy is available in the first round, otherwise move along.
They need a free OR strong safety. We need quality safety play, and we need someone who can fill in for Troy.
Once again the steelers have put themselves into a position to draft BPA, despite the echoes of steelers fans jumping off bridges.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
by steelguy99 on Dec 7, 2009 12:15 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m staying away from any and all bridges on Thursday
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
Easy to say. Us in Pittsburgh are pretty screwed.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
What bridges?
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
The best part is ALL OF THEM have construction going on. ALL THE TIME.
We will unleash Hell in December.
-Mike Tomlin
did Bodden sign a 1 year deal with the Pats?
great stuff, i couldn’t agree more with what you were saying.
Secondary
I am slowly coming to like Burnett. Yesterday’s game clinching dropped INT aside I think he is a play maker. I don’t see him as a starting CB and I don’t see him as a PR but on ST and as an extra DB in coverage I think he will be more than adequate. Interested to see K Lewis on Thursday. I hope they can upgrade 23 & 26 next year early in the draft. When is Ike up?
When You Run The Ball Good Things Happen
That's funny that you mentioned Chad Scott because
I ran into him at the jewelry store tonight. Nobody was around, so I was able to talk with him.He stated that the defense that Pittsburgh employs isn’t set up for cornerbacks to be playmakers. He said Dick Lebeau’s defense is set up for all the glory to go to the outside linebackers. Don’t get me wrong, I know Lebeau is a defensive wizard BUT there is now a body of evidence that suggests that teams know how to attack Lebeau’s defense late in games. Let’s face it, it’s been our achilles heel all season.
he secondary was a joke in the 4th quarter. Who cares if we get to the playoffs with that garbage on the team
total joke. it was real funny too
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
Thanks as ever
for the levelheaded analysis. It is really helpful to new students of the game like me to have things pulled together thoughtfully and dispassionately, without either unwarranted optimism or overwhelming negativity. It’s also really nice to know that one can care very much about the team and the outcome of the games without getting stupid – something that I sometimes wonder about on this and similar forums…
by momma rollett on Dec 7, 2009 8:19 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Yes Blitz
You got a way putting into words some of the more obscure ideas I ponder with my limited football knowledge.
One thing I am not aware of being brought up is Dick LeBeau. At what point can one measure a decline in an Icon’s performance? and how far (long) can it decline before that performance becomes average? Certainly it is harder to define this for a coach than a player.
If LeBeau’s performance has declined age will be blamed. But it should be pointed out that his wife died earlier this season and only those of us who have gone thru that know how much it takes out of you.
by steelerstyle on Dec 7, 2009 11:08 AM EST up reply actions
Good analysis.......
but maybe the Steelers shouldn’t be placing so much faith in a 34-yr old DE who has had injury problems two of the last three seasons,and may be in the twilight of his career,and a freakishly talented but oft-injured safety who only seems to be on the field about half the time for them.
As for Townsend,perhaps the problem there is that at his age,and after all those years in the league,he’s simply at the endof the trail? It certainly looks that way.
Totally agree
But they did the exact same thing by reupping Keisel this year. Keisel has played well this year, but that is not the measuring stick of a contract, since he was already under contract this year. Does anyone really think Keisel will be a reliable contributor four years from now?
by CarlWeathersMustache on Dec 7, 2009 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
This Secondary is bad
Really, really bad. William Gay is not an NFL corner. I’m sorry, but he is really bad. I understand that he is getting “picked on,” but he is constantly beat. It is not just every once and awhile, it is nearly every play and a lot of the times he is beat really badly.
Anyway, when a safety is 3rd in tackles on your team (and that guy’s name is not Troy or Polamalu), by a small margin, you’ve got problems. Actually I just looked at it, and William Gay and Ryan Clark have more tackles than all but 2 of TP’s seasons. They are on pace to shatter those two though. Both have 64 tackles and TP’s career high is 74. That is awful.
Ryan Mundy, you might as well have put on a Raiders jersey yesterday. You concuss a Steeler, get a blatant personal foul, and then get beat for the TD. I hope you feel like crap today because you pretty much created the Raiders game-winning TD.
Ike Taylor was beat quite often yesterday, none more noticeable than the “Punt” completion that Gradkowski completed on the last drive of the game. How in the world do you let that receiver catch the ball? It is becoming increasing difficult to defend Ike’s hands. On that play even a bad CB gets his hands on the ball or makes a play.
Yes, the secondary gets better with Troy’s return. However, it still has a lot of problems that prevent it from being a top tier defense. Gay is not an NFL starter. Ryan Clark makes bad decisions. The depth at safety is bad. Its becoming so blatantly obvious that Harrison is held that even the bad announcers like Gumble are noticing it. Farrior gets beat often.
Bring on the draft and get me a CB, ILB, Safety, and possibly a high draft NT.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
I’m not sure if any member of Steeler backfield other than Troy could intercept a wedding bouquet at this point. If I were Brian Daboll, I’d draw up a play where Brady Quinn turns his back to the line of scrimmage and just heaves the ball directly over his head. I’d wager it goes for a touchdown.
by pghnorthside on Dec 7, 2009 10:13 AM EST up reply actions
Mundy did not lose the game.
Though he may have been the single biggest contributer.
The game was lost by two red zone trips and three points.
by steelerstyle on Dec 7, 2009 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
Both sides of the ball.
Raiders haven’t scored more than 21 points this entire season, yesterday they scored 27.
Offense should have scored a lot more.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
Truth. They go 0 for 3 in the first three RZ trips as far as getting a TD goes. And they only got 3 points total on those trips. That is awful.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
Fair enough....
….. but 77 points in the last four games for the offense is a very disappointing tally for a unit that is for the most part, healthy.
Two of our three best players on defense are injured and the unit is no longer dominant, but they’re still a top 5 defense and most other teams would love to have them, giving big plays and all.
As for the other side of the ball, other teams may want the players but I’d doubt they’d want the offense. The offense needs stop waiting for the defense to come around and return a favor and carry them for awhile.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
Certainly the offense is underperforming, and has for most of the Arians era. The steelers look great on offense when you look at yards, and they look not-so-hot when you look at points scored. Offense needs to improve, but they did look pretty decent last week playing with a UDFA rookie guard and a 3rd string QB. They flash signs, but can’t put it all together, and can’t put it together consistently.
The defense gets a pass allowing decent offenses to score. They don’t get a pass, regardless of who is missing, allowing the raiders and chiefs to beat us. That’s inexcusable, just like the offensive performance.
One thing I’d like to address is “the talent we have on offense”. The talent we have on offense is only as good as it performs. It is easy to blame Arians is for not putting them in a position to succeed, but steelers fans have been assuming that we have top-tier talent, and that is not the case in a lot of positions. I like Holmes and I like Rashard, but they don’t perform at a consistently high level. Is that their fault or Arians? Consensus says Brucey, but I’m not so sure. I won’t think keeping Arians around is a mistake, but I sure as hell won’t miss him if he gets the axe.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
Re:Arians
and if he plans practices like he plans games?
PS. I’m not absolving the defense of it’s failings, I’m merely suggesting that those failings wouldn’t be catastrophic if other failings weren’t being cuddled like a baby.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
When did I say Mundy lost the game? I said he pretty much created the Raiders game winning drive, which is true.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
Agree about Ike Taylors play.
IMO Troy’s biggest contribution is he inspires the rest of the defense.
by steelerstyle on Dec 7, 2009 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
it's like walking down the street with you big brother
nobody can touch you because if they do, he’ll be there to step in.
Heath Miller
Not sure if you mentioned this in your other write-up or not. I haven’t read it (did read this one). What did he get, 2 or 3 looks all game? 1 catch for Heath Miller. What happened between now and the beginning of the year? Remember when Miller was in contention to have the best numbers for a TE in the league? Is it Ben or BA that rarely looks for the big guy in the RZ and on crucial 3rd down plays. That is generally when the utilization of a TE comes up big.
Also, speaking of receptions, besides the big two, there were 4 other receptions by 3 other guys! Are you kidding me? 1 reception by an HB out of the back field. One! Is Ben not checking down or is it BA not making play calls to use them? You would think, since we get lit up by those type of plays that BA would figure out they are useful. I suppose I am expecting too much from him at this point.
Props to Ward and Holmes having great days. Holmes looked like the stud we all thought he was yesterday. Props to Wallace for making a lot of nice blocks in the open field.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
check-downs
I believe that Ben struggles reading coverages quickly. That is why on pass plays, he, and the O-line do all that pointing, and why the play clock runs down to one second before we snap the ball. It is also why he likes to “extend the play”, it gives him more time to figure out the D. If Ben can throw the long ball, which he throws extremely well, he doesn’t have to worry about it getting picked off by all the defensive “traffic” on the underneath and check-down routes.
Our red-zone offensive troubles also support this theory.
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 7, 2009 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
i would've loved getting heath more involved...especially since i started him in fantasy football
but ben only didnt complete 6 passes and one of those was a drop by heath. can’t blame this one on ben (and also have to admit heath has been dropping a few more passes recently than what he normally does).
We went 3 for 9 on 3rd Down
Out of those 6 failures, 5 of them were pass attempts. Take away one because it was 3rd and 24. That is 4 attempts when we should have looked for something to Heath.
On the drops, Holmes had a lot (considerably more than Heath) at the beginning of the year, did we stop looking his way? No. Good players miss plays occasionally. Its really dumb to stop going there way because of a few drops.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
I haven't seen that
Especially when he lines up on the line and peels off on a quick underneath route.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
heath & a subjective observation
I don’t have tivo and re-watch the games, etc. so don’t have hard numbers, but my impression is that there are plenty of plays that Heath is blocking and not running a route. We lineup in the 3 receiver sets and the WRs run the patterns while Heath is cleaning up blitzers or DEs. yes?
Likewise, I was wondering what happened to Woodley this season and have noticed he fairly consistently drops into coverage (hence the dropoff in his pressures and sacks??). Not sure if that’s a function of missing Troy and getting more ’backers into coverage or that they trust him to do more than rush the QB in passing situations.
by lamarr_the_BEAST! on Dec 7, 2009 4:58 PM EST up reply actions
And has there been....
a Keenan Lewis sighting? You would think that a rookie CB that was so highly touted at the beginning of the season would have made SOME contribution this year,either on defense or special teams,or both?
I believe he was inactive yesterday
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
Troy and Aaron
I really do believe those two guys being out is the cause of the big pain on D.
Without Smith, the LBs have to take more time to get to the QB, thus giving the QB more time to throw the ball….it’s now like 3-5 seconds instead of 2-4 and that’s a huge difference.
With no Troy back there running like a madmen, the other slower DBs have to cover more range, of which they don’t have…..plus we already knew that Troy is the one with the hands and everyone else has bricks.
So…..While I, like everyone else, thought the others could step up and help out….obviously they can’t and won’t.
Best we can hope for is that Troy gets back after the Browns game, Steelers somehow win the last 4, other teams flake out, and they squeak in and get on a roll.
Stranger things must have happened!
Irony
Tomlin must have meant that he was “unleashing hell” and anguish on all Steelers fan across the country.
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
Big mistake by the 3rd year coach. The Raiders have played mostly uninspired football all year. Why give them any motivation? The worst thing you can do to NFL players is challenge their toughness, and it was a backhanded form of taunting the upcoming opponents. Wouldn’t be surprised to see CLE respond as well. The quote made it sound like the Steelers are ready to pummel everyone in their way (obviously they are not). I’m not surprised that OAK stepped it up – what else do they have to play for? We may have the same attitude in a few weeks, or we may fold it up and go home.
Frankly, this team was disappointing at 6-2 and I had concerns even then. Getting knocked out of the playoff race by week 13 wasn’t one of them, but they weren’t playing championship football at any point this season. I’m still rooting, but I’m also a little relieved that they showed their true colors early enough to squash any false hope. We’ll be watching the playoffs from home and contemplating a mid to upper-mid first round draft slot for 2010.
by chicos_pants on Dec 7, 2009 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
How was it a mistake?
All he basically said was that his team would play like madmen in December. I really don’t see any slight towards the Raiders with what he said.
by StoneColdSteel on Dec 7, 2009 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
D blows yet another game in the 4th quarter?
Shocking! Actually, not so much, and the secondary D just blows period. I really hope that both Burnett and Lewis amount to something…soon. Gay isn’t starter material, Deshea is done, and Carter is a mediocre backup who is getting a little long in the tooth to boot. “…the only solution really is to retool the roster some this spring and summer so that the team is not so heavily dependent on #43’s presence”. Amen. For the past two years I’ve worried what’s going to happen to our D when Polamalu’s gone for good. He’s a unique talent, and we’re never going to find a replacement, but the FO needs to try, starting with the next draft. Aside from maybe one or two O-Line picks (in the mid-to-lower rounds), the majority of the picks need to be DB, S, and D-Line.
by SteelerFanInPatsieLand on Dec 7, 2009 9:58 AM EST reply actions
Starkey and Lolley sum up my feeling
“Starkey: The Steelers stink” (harsh, but accurate given the last four games:
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_656556.html
Lolley’s Post-Game Thoughts:
http://nflfromthesidelines.blogspot.com/2009/12/steelers-raiders-post-game-thoughts.html
I guess Bouchette mentioned something about heads rolling on PG+, b/c Dale wrote the following response to a poster:
“Any names at this point would be purely speculation on everyone’s part, including Ed’s. That’s why he didn’t name names. They aren’t going to throw any coaches under the bus with four games remaining. It’s not what they do.
But you can bet there will be a change on special teams and I wouldn’t bet against a secondary change." Yeah, there damn well better be…
by SteelerFanInPatsieLand on Dec 7, 2009 10:04 AM EST reply actions
I feel that Lolley provides this great service with his blog and then in the comments section he just ends up getting ripped by a bunch of douches. I have no idea why he does it, but I’m glad he does.
by BluegrassSteeler on Dec 7, 2009 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Me too, and the only comments I read in the blog’s comments section are Dale’s. Everyone is is either “Anonymous” or “Patrick”.
by SteelerFanInPatsieLand on Dec 7, 2009 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
Troy & Company...and the Coming Youth Movement on D
The most startling stat there is the number of touchdowns thrown without Troy – and keep in mind we had Troy when we played teams like the Vikes and the Broncos. Opposing QB’s rightly have no fear throwing deep against us without Troy – at worst it’s an incompletion. They know the chances are slim anybody will actually play the ball and with the sheer amount of times Ike is getting beat in one on ones this season they might draw a PI even if their guy doesn’t catch it.
The lack of communication among the D is also troubling. Apparently there were a number of blown coverages – including the last TD pass – simply because the DB’s didn’t know what the call was supposed to be. As the helmet guy, some of that falls on Farrior, but it’s not a problem that a professional team should have in the first place.
One thing people need to be more willing to admit is the role that age has played in the collapse of our much vaunted D. Townsend is done, Farrior’s speed is in quick decline (and with that his every down status), Smith and Hampton are both in their mid -30’s. I think it may be time to admit that this particular defense has peaked and that we need to start a mass youth movement even if it means that we’re going to give up more yards/points in the short term. You can look at the Pats as a good example of this – they’ve traded off and let a lot of older starters go for relatively high draft picks. They’ve inserted rookies and second year players in positions that they might normally look for a veteran FA to play. Not surprisingly, defensively they aren’t have a great season, but in a year or two when those young guys get it together, they’ll be a force to be reckoned with. I think it’s time we admit that this needs to happen for us next season.
by BluegrassSteeler on Dec 7, 2009 10:09 AM EST reply actions
efensive secondary
cause there certainly was no D in it!! This has resulted in at least 2 losses and will probably result in another. Time to do some catching drills in practice for the efensive backs. T&T on the “punt pass” look utterly inept. Maybe missing the playoffs wouldn’t be such a bad thing, force management to look seriously at this obvious problem.
Thanks for the analysis!
You always make me feel better Blitz, and I appreciate it.
A couple of thoughts:
- Townsend is probably done. He was never that fast, but I think he has lost the 1/2 step he had and it isn’t good enough anymore. I love the guy, but I think he needs to go.
- I am not sure about Gay. He might be ok next year. This is his first year as a starter.
- All the young guys (Burnett, Lewis, etc.) may make a big jump between this year and next. I agree with you that we could be setup for a nice mix of young talent and veterans starting next year.
- I love how hard Mendy is running the ball. Colbert does it again.
- I am not that down on Timmons because I know he has been playing hurt all year. He hurt BOTH ankles this year. I think he would be awesome if he was healthy.
- I want to keep the belief alive for the playoffs this year, but I am pretty much resigned to not making it. If we had won the Baltimore game, I think we would have won yesterday and at the Browns. I just think that game was deflating for the team.
- I stood up for Bruce Arians in the past, but I can’t anymore. Mendy didn’t get a carry in the 2nd quarter after really running hard in the first. I just think Tomlin is going to have to seriously think about letting that guy go along with the special teams coach and maybe the DB’s coach. We have way too much talent on offense not to dominate games. It is very frustrating. Heck, I would take a consistent, plan oriented play calling set.
- I never saw this streak coming. I guess it is harder than I thought to repeat a Super Bowl championship. Hopefully it means we will have a good year next year.
ekl
"You have to under promise and over deliver." Mike Tomlin
On Lean Joe Burnett
Somewhat tangentially, everyone is ragging on Burnett for a pretty good reason. However, I think of note is that, as far as I can tell, Joe didn’t seem to get burned. Sure he dropped an INT, but he was right in the way of the ball, and was sticking to his guys pretty well.
I had a hard time telling that late in the game of course, and Peyton Gradkowski was carving up our secondary and our safeties and nickel backs were doing their best “everyone dance together in the middle of the field” performance, but Joe looked pretty good.
I wonder how Keenan would have done, he was sitting on the sidelines presumably because Joe is a better STer. When you have a 5th round rookie starting as a CB in this league, good things typically don’t follow. Mundy can pray all he want, but I think he would be better spending that time punching himself in the face.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
Dominoes
If we had won the Baltimore game, I think we would have won yesterday and at the Browns. I just think that game was deflating for the team
If we had not given up a kickoff return TD to start the Chiefs game, we would have won that game, and Ben would not have gotten hurt. If Ben had not been hurt, we would have won the Ravens game. If we had won the Ravens game…
I think MT waited one game too long to fix the special teams problems.
NOT HUNGRY ENOUGH
we can analyze all we want about current steelers personnel and their talents (or lack thereof)…but it’s becoming painfully obvious that our current steelers team is just lacking in one crucial department – the desire to be the best – at all levels period…it’s just not there this year as it was in previous Super Bowl years e.g., 2005 and 2008…it might have been there at summer camp but it slowly melted away as injuries started to pile up…though nobody will ever admit that inside most of the players they’ll just be happy to survive the season healthy… then prep again for another SB run in 2010…who says you have to be Champs back-to-back to be an NFL dynasty anyways…that’s what super teams did in the ’70’s and ’80’s…but in today’s NFL reality (injuries, free agencies, trades, etc.,) that’s becoming more and more a fantasy…it’s harder to motivate multi-millionaires to bang up their bodies and heads weekend-weekout…the hunger for fan and peer recognition and a major payback (rich multi year contracts) is just not the same even though one can argue that they’re supposed to be professionals and they’ll put in an honest day’s work for their paycheque…and their lies the problem as some of them are now just going thru the motions with really no more “fire in the belly” …hey they are still SB Champs…but someone forgot to tell them that it was sooooo last year already…time to suck up, dig deeper and fire up some winning passion again and strive for your personal best every weekend and every snap otherwise they should just join the PGA Tour or something…
You know
Its never a good sign when your coach starts refrencing Jim Mora’s “play off what do you mean play off’s”meltdown
by mississippisaintsfan on Dec 7, 2009 10:17 AM EST reply actions
"You know"
great all the saints fans have opinions to share now. This is a total disaster…
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
Even with some key injuries and the ball not bouncing our way...
we would have a decent chance of only having 3 losses instead of 6 if Arians would not be a pass-happy fucker in the red zone. I will say this again. When you are leading and have the ball 1st and ten from the 16 yard line, you need to run the damned football. Give it to Mendy 3 or 4 times in a row. He’s getting you 5 yards a pop for crying out loud. Throwing the ball in that situation is more risk than reward. Tomlin needs to relieve BA from redzone playcalling while looking for the idiot’s replacement. Stupid motherfucker.
Agreed
Mendy was really moving the pile yesterday even when there was not much of a hole. I am really starting to like that guy. He has been covering up the ball much better as well. I think he is going to be a stud. They could have given it to Menday on the 4th and 1 near the goal line. He would have busted the pile and gotten the yard.
ekl
"You have to under promise and over deliver." Mike Tomlin
The TD run he made was a brilliant individual effort. The guy has a nose for the end zone.
by BluegrassSteeler on Dec 7, 2009 12:19 PM EST up reply actions
“You have to under promise and over deliver.” Mike Tomlin
I wonder if Coach T forgot his principles when he made that “Unleash Hell” comment.
by Han on Dec 7, 2009 12:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed
If you give the ball to Mendy a couple times in the RZ he picks up the tough yards and could get us in the end zone. Not to mention by running the ball down there we could set up the play action pass which works well for us. By keeping the defense honest and guessing on what we are going to run, we increase the chances of scoring 6. But, Arians has proven all year that is not one of his strong points.
Why?
I still dont understand why the secondary coach should go.The defensive coordinator is involved in the starting lineup as much the assistant. If not more. We simply lack talent period in the secondary. Its going to come down to taking a look at free agency and the draft to aquire top-notch secondary talent or a few seasons for mediocre talent to develop. Also we may need to go ahead and spend some money. Go Steelers!
Notice how LeBeau started blitzing Ike and Gay when both wouldn't make a play on the ball
Better to have them attacking the line rather than dropping back in coverage giving up easy plays. Just like I said with the special teams kickoff coverage unit, the Steelers secondary isn’t a schematics problem, it’s a personnel issue. This team needs to get better CBs and safeties next year.
by datruth4life on Dec 7, 2009 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
Good observations regarding the defense.
Even though I think the Steelers are history for this season, you’re absolutely right about how football is the consummate team sport and all of the positions are interrelated. This team has a solid core of talent, but it’s fraying badly around the edges these days.
I also agree that it’s hard to figure out why Townsend is even allowed to be on the field anymore. It’s sad because he used to be a big part of the D, but he’s clearly finished as an NFL player. We definitely need some big-time help in the secondary come Draft Day 2010. We need a premier guy who can come in and start right away.
If the steelers draft anyone high it will be a safety. I don’t think they’ll draft a corner that high.
I also expect we have no clue who the steelers will actually draft, they are an enigma.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
Simply running the ball more will lead to more points...
instead of retarded interceptions. It will also let the defense rest up while we eat up the clock.
Gonna need more help on the OL
The Steelers have only been able to run the ball sporadically for the past two seasons. Some people think this is due to misguided play calling. I don’t like the offensive coaching either but I just don’t think the Steeler OL is good enough to pound the ball on the ground. We obviously need help at DB in the draft, but we also need more help on the OL.
Do you honestly think improving the OL is going to help us run the ball while BA is here?
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 7, 2009 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
We ran the ball 24 times against the 31st ranked defense. There is no need for “trickery”, there is no excuse. The line did not create holes, Mendenhall/FWP/Moore did not do enough. That is not on the coordinator.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
No holes? Maybe a fullback could have helped with that.
According to this the raiders defense is ranked 24th and their offense is ranked 31st. But those stats may have changed since our game yesterday. By the way, where is a better place to look for NFL rankings for rushing and passing offenses and defenses?
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 7, 2009 8:06 PM EST up reply actions
Disagree
Mendenhall cracked the century mark and averaged over 5 yards a carry. FWP averaged 5 yards a carry. The team averaged 4.9 yards a carry. Blame can be spreaded around yes, but when you are getting those kinds of yards and its working why do we continually go away from it. BA has proven he doesn’t stick with what works. When the running game is producing, we go away from it. Being that they were the 30th (after this week) ranked rush defense, we should have ran the ball more than 24 times, with the production we were getting. That does fall on BA.
I am new to the boot BA movement, but have now arrived.
I don’t think Mike Tomlin will fire him during the season. For one reason, I get the feeling Mike has a great sense of loyalty. And for another reason, I don’t see that it serves any purpose to fire him before the season is over. But I would love this offense to take another direction.
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 7, 2009 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
Drafts?
You mean to get set up for 2011 or 2012? Because as Blitz pointed out, very few rookies make an significant impact or get that much playing time (exception, this year).
That being said, I like that the Steelers build the way they do. Blitz pointing out that there is an underlying philosophy of ‘rely on draft and player development’ keeps you consistently competitive and in the hunt, but not in the Bowl on consecutive years.
I think the history of consecutive wins back in the day creeps in and fans want it again. And that is how dynasties are identified. But look at the Cowboy and 49er dynasty years….followed eventually by rock bottom.
There's something to be said for that
I wasn’t able to watch, but was tracking the game online. Early in the first half, or maybe all of it, the time of possession was pretty lop sided. Made me worried about the defense. Running the ball like you suggest would help, as long as the drives are extended ones. The D would benefit from some help to be ready for the last quarter.
Someone commented somewhere that maybe when Troy comes back, they should wait until the 4th to put him in. I think it would drive him crazy to be suited up and not playing, but maybe that would help him to not get re-injured, and be a boost physically and emotionally when he did arrive in the second half.
One thing is for sure, no “rest him, its just the Browns”, or “thats ok, we have some gimme games before the tough ones.” Any given sunday, a gimme game is one you have make happen, just like a hard fought win
Foolish me
But think about it…think how amped up he would be when he finally got in….he wouldn’t touch the ground.
Couple of random thoughts
I watched the game yesterday with my five and a half year-old son. For the first time I think he understands what an emotional roller coaster watching your favorite team can be. I’m glad he was around so I didn’t smash anything…
A couple of times in the past few years Troy has been quoted as saying that our defense is predicated on the offense possessing the ball. This tends to get forgotten when we’re singling out individual culprits or calling for heads to roll. I think the single biggest misalignment on the team may be Lebeau’s defensive philosophy alongside BA’s offensive “strategy.” Our defense is supposed to make opposing offenses one dimensional by totally shutting down the run. Then, we stop all big plays and eventually sack the quarterback and/or cause a turnover. The fact that those things aren’t happening falls heavily on the individual players, but Troy’s point was that our style of defense is unsustainable if we lose the time of possession battle. The longer our defense is on the field, the more likely it is that opponents will find its weaknesses.
Also, our coaches have been slow to adapt to the reality that is our Troy-less ‘09 D. I know it goes against football logic, and maybe I’m crazy, but as soon as Hines scored his TD, while my son was celebrating I’m thinking “they left too much time on the clock.” Knowing that our D can’t hold a lead, even at the risk of shelving what was otherwise a great play (or saving it for another down or two), maybe we take our time and try to score with only a few seconds left?
Hard to chew clock
When all our offense can consistently do, is complete the deep ball. When we get in the red-zone, we need to take a sack back to the 40, so we can have the deep ball again for the chance for a TD.
Nice point on the offensive and defensive strategies not working together, seriously.
"We just have to play better as a whole team." James Harrison
by LongTimeSteelersFan on Dec 7, 2009 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
time of posession
going into the 4th quarter was: Oak=22:43 Pitt=22:17
there is a difference when the offense doesnt hold on to the ball long enough and the defense can’t get themselves off the field. the defense lost this battle themselves in the 4th quarter
Sure, the defense blew the lead
but Troy’s point is that everything is connected. In the Bus’s hey day, time of possession was often 60-40 in our favor. Any coincidence about Cowher’s record when the Steelers led at halftime? I know today’s NFL is different, and maybe a time of possession focused ground game isn’t going to happen. But doesn’t Indy run a clock control offense focused mostly on the pass? In part they do that to compensate for what has been their historic weakness on D: (especially when Sanders is injured) stopping the run. Couldn’t we try controlling the clock to minimize or weaknesses in the secondary without Troy?
i agree it wouldve helped the D if the offense dominated time of possession
and they didnt and were expected to. but the offense didnt put the defense at a disadvantage…only left them on even footing. to blame the offense for not giving the defense a huge advantage is pointing fingers at the wrong ppl.
why not blame the defense for getting no turnovers…that would’ve helped the offense?
Why is it...
….always the defense that has to step up and help the offense and never the other way around?
The defense for the first time since late ‘06 is off kelter and they can’t get a bailout.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
NO
read the post for ONCE. i’m not asking the defense to help the offense. i’m asking the defense to hold their own. to keep the chiefs or the raiders from scoring TWENTY-SEVEN points against us. thats all
It's been....
…..the defense that’s been carrying the responsibility of us being successful for the past three years, cut them some slack on the rare stretch where they struggle some.
and…
why not blame the defense for getting no turnovers…that would’ve helped the offense?
…is asking for help.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions
Valid points all 47. Cowher was something like 120-1-1 with an 11 point lead in the 4th quarter. The Steelers have lost at least 4 games like that this year!
Under BA the Steelers are a 2 play drive “big play” offense. The defense is forced to spend too much time on the field, especially later in the game.
Each time the Steelers got the ball in the 4th quarter I asked for an X minute drive ending with Mendenhall plowing into the EZ for 6 with seconds left. Each time they went up top early and got the scores that eluded them in the first half. And then with always enough time on the clock the injured and aged defense got smacked.
When You Run The Ball Good Things Happen
11 point lead?
Check your numbers. The only loss this year in which the Steelers led by 11 was the first Cincy game. We were up 10 on the Chiefs at halftime. We’ve been blowing leads, but mostly small ones. If the offense could open up a bigger gap, it might help.
What was the total ToP for the first half?
up until midway in the second, it was something like 17 mins Oak, 7.5 Pitt.
Good post thanks
I couldn’t bring myself to read anything about the NFL until now. Bummed yes. Still opportunity upcoming, still wanna believe. Gotta ask…43 back on Thursday?
"Now that I'm here, I don't want to just be here, I want to be here for a long time." Hines Ward, 1998 4th round draft pick.
by kick him in the head on Dec 7, 2009 11:25 AM EST reply actions
comments about not running the ball enough
play calling before trailing in the 4th quarter:
passes: 18 (and i’m counting ben’s first scramble as a called pass play)
runs: 21
we were easily on pace to have a 30+ run att game everytime the offense got on the field in the 4th quarter they were playing from behind
should read
“att in the game until everytime”
true but...
when you give up the run to pass in the red zone you ask for trouble. BA has gotten predictable in his play calling. he will run the ball 2-3 times with success then pass. i know you want to keep the defense guessing, but if it is working why change it? in the RZ, especially within the 10 yard line, run it there is not enough field for extended patterns and everyone is jammed inthe end zone.
the interception wasnt BA's fault
that was ben’s fault. and i’m tired of ppl throwing out stereotypical blame for losses.
1st trip in zone: 1st & 10) pass →5 yard gain→ loss of yard
2nd & 5) run
3rd & 6) pass—>incomplete
4th) field goal
2nd trip: 1st & 10) run—>4 yards
2nd & 6) run → 5 yards→no gain
3rd & 1) run
4th & 1)run —> no gain
3rd trip: 1st & 10)pass—>interception
4th trip: 1st & goal)run—>TD
5th trip: 1st & 10)run—>2 yards
2nd & 8)run—>8 yards
1st & 10)pass—>TD
so…..um……where is this predictable play calling where he gives up on the run to pass? 3rd & 6 is a passing down and Ben made a bad decision on the pass.
One of the problems ....
…with BA is he doesn’t want to be balanced. I once heard him say after a game in which the Steelers had 60 snaps the reason we weren’t balanced was because we didn’t have enough snaps.
He has stretches where he inappropriately abandons the run and then inappropriately tries to retrieve balance. This will look better on paper at the end of the day but is more often than not almost as bad as being unbalanced throughout.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
Nice contribution
Wall of Shame
-"I’m glad we play Pitt twice, and not Tenn this year." - Brownie's Year
-"BB is ok (slightly overated)…but he is NO Kyle Orton! I’ll take Kyle over Ben any day" - Bronco_Fan_Tom
-PIT 24 KC 27
-Mike Tomlin's idea of "Unleashing Hell"
43 will probably not be back thursday...
and it shouldn’t even matter, bc it’s freaking cleveland. But…of course those other teams were oakland and the damned chiefs…I say give me arians head on a stick. running the football is your best option most of the time. I cannot believe that we call the plays we call…he has to go.
2 other things
-i really like you calling out Mundy for leading with his head. not only did it cost us in field position with a penalty, but more importantly (and not mentioned) it also lead to gay getting injured and our bad secondary getting worse because his backup having to play…maybe gay would’ve made the INT burnett dropped.
and as a side note, the leading with the head is a good penalty to have because Mundy did it twice & a player left the field injured both times.
-i like how you called out the team for biting on the run too much. Tomlin alluded to Taylor supposed to having safety help on the 75 yard play and Taylor being in proper position. when you look at the replay both carter and clark bite pretty hard on the play action since it was 3rd and 2
Drafting has been bad the past 3 years
We are probably facing a serious rebuilding period. The last three drafts have only netted 3 starters (if we all agree Gay is a nickel not a starter) – Woodley, Mendy, and Timmons (a number of folks on here don’t even think he should be a starting ILB which I agree, he’s a better OLB).
As far as FAs pickups, Fox looks good, but thats about it, Moore had a bad year and looks to be injury prone as advertised when we first picked him up. And Hartwig is getting close to being done.
Thats not good – compare this to Jacksonville, no fan base, 12 rookies in the starting lineup, and they are 7-5.
you are kidding right?
they have 4 rookies that are starting combined on both sides of the ball
rebuilding? we have a QB in his prime, we have a really good 2nd year running back, we have a great tight end in his prime and i like the rookie david johnson as his back up, our entire line is young / in their prime less hartwig who is the oldest, our LB’s are 2nd and 3rd year players that show great promise less james farrior who is 34 i believe, ike taylor is in his prime and considered a shut down corner (who can’t catch) troy is troy albeit injured this year, we just drafted to corner’s who are learning a very complex defensive scheme, i could go on and on.
“Moore had a bad year and looks to be injury prone as advertised when we first picked him up?” he hasn’t missed any significant time due to injury his first two years with us and his QB calls him the chain mover as in he get’s the tough 3rd down conversions.
not sure what Farm you are watching the games on down there in Florida or what resource you used to claim that the jaguars are starting 12 rookies but you my friend are not even close on your post in any regard.
Kevin Colbert is regarded around the league as a top notch player personel guy.
Serious rebuilding???
Not hardly. We aren’t playing well, but we aren’t seriously rebuilding.
I love being the most-hated guy here. I love beating them while [their fans] are flicking me off. --Hines Ward
yep seriously
gotta replace the following next year:
2 DL, Snack and Smith
1 LB, Farrior
2 DB, Gay and Clark,
not to mention hoke, Kir, and Kei, Harrison are not spring chickens either
Team is also going to need a new ST coach and redo the special teams
Team also needs a new kicker.
Also need a new OC.
the offense has a lot of youth and some good players, but so do a lot of other AFC teams. There’s nothing our offense has that at least half dozen pother AFC can’t easily match.
Replacements already in place
Aaron Smith will be back next year. Ziggy Hood is available to replace either Smith or Keisel as needed. Fox is available to replace Farrior. Burnett and Lewis can step in for Gay—don’t give up on these young guys yet. You don’t need draft choices to replace kickers or coaches, so that’s not a problem.
The two biggest holes for next year are at NT (unless they tag Hampton) and FS. That’s not a lot to ask for in one draft. Then we can pick up some depth in the lower rounds.
I hear ya, just have doubts
Don’t think they are all going to pan out. Having a problem with Hood as a first rounder not being able to beat out Eason. And Smith is what 35 coming off a serious injury? I’m ok with Fox but that leaves no depth at LB. Burnett and Lewis? I wouldn’t bet on both coming thru and we actually need to replace Mundy. Carter, and Townsend as well as upgrade Gay and replace Clark. And Troy another year older and another injury to get past? the way he plays, he’s not going to play into his 30s, and I think he’s one of those guys who is very at peace with things and will hang it up early rather than later.
I just don’t see us with enuff in the pipeline, I think the 2008 draft really screwed us and not picking up any FAs at the same time is creating a situation where the defensive rotations and the ability to mix presonnel to packages are just not going to be there next year.
You only really need one or two guys a draft for it to work out with 22 guys playing. The supplemental guys like 2nd TE (a “starter” you left out, btw, etc.) don’t need to be “hits”, they just need to work out enough. If they were studs they wouldn’t be 2nd TEs for very long and would move on to other teams.
One, preferably two, guys a draft gives you enough bodies to move along with occasional free agent pick up and with the steelers especially, some impressive mining of the UDFA pool.
The steelers have blown a lot of drafts. 2004 only netted two starters with the team now, Ben and Starks. 2003 gave us Troy and Ike. 2002 was a great year. The 2009 gave us who knows who, but probably a few starters. The 2008 draft gave us Mendenhall and maybe some others. The 2007 draft gave us Timmons, Woodley, Spaeth, Sepulveda, Gay (nickel back counts as a starter nowadays, if he is even that), Stapleton. 2006 gives us Holmes, Colon. No epic drafts there, but you aren’t going to have one of those every year. 2009 could go down as one of those, but it’s too soon to tell.
I think you are confusing rookies playing with rookies being good. I would love if all of our rookies came in and were studs their first year. I don’t know when the last time that happened with the steelers was, and I think the steelers have shown that their ship runs pretty straight.
It’s easy to point to any team that has a better record than us and say that they are better than us (because they are), but it’s also noteworthy to take into account their consistency. Many of those teams have similar ways of going about things as the steelers, some of them are one-hit wonders. None of them have consistently hit the jackpot every year in the draft, none of them have consistently hit the jackpot the last few years in the draft.
Are the steelers rebuilding? Of course they are. Every year they have a few holes, and they’ll work on plugging those. While plugging those holes they will unearth others, otherwise they would be a perfect team.
If you want to see real, true, serious rebuilding, you really should follow the browns for awhile before attaching that label to the steelers.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
Didn't the 2009 draft...
give us Mike Wallace?
by momma rollett on Dec 7, 2009 7:00 PM EST up reply actions
And David Johnson. He’s great value for what’s usually a throw away pick.
by BluegrassSteeler on Dec 7, 2009 8:18 PM EST up reply actions
agree with david johnson
he will make Spaeth expendable
by nycsteelerfan on Dec 8, 2009 7:16 PM EST up reply actions
again, hear you and to a point agree
And Cleveland is not rebuilding, they are floundering, I’m talking you make some hard decisions now to inject youth into the lineup on defense, struggle for a year and be right back into the thick of things in two, while BB is still young enuff. I think they should let go of hampton, kirchke, hoke, eason, farrior, carter, townsend, carter, smith, and start plugging now. doing it piecemeal is not going to work due to salary cap issues. (this is what the hated bilishit is doing in new england before brady gets too old so they can make one more run)
But I think what concerns me is I have never seen so many bad decisions made in one year by the Steelers. Mistakes:
1. putting troy back in against CLEVELAND before he was ready.
2. Keeping and “starting” FWP over Mendy, eating up 4 million in cap money.
3. doing nothing about the secondary (except losing McF) after seeing the secondary struggle thru the playoffs and SB last year.
4. Bruce Arians.
5. NOt getting an adult in the organization to manage BB (like Whiz did), this relationship between BB and BA is not good for the team.
6. allowing the ST to deteriorate to the extent they did, never a good sign of a healthy organization.
And I hear you about other teams, but what I see though is a lot of these teams are as good as we are right now and they are younger: Jacksonville, Bengals, Texans, Miami, Jets (although not sold on sanchise), Denver, SD. (not even going to mention Indy and Pats)
Yes, we need to get younger on defense, but you can’t just let all the veterans walk after one year. What you are asking for would end up number 7 on your list for bad decisions. The young guys need to have some time sitting back and learning how to play in our defense. Smith is still very good, but gets injured, keep him until his contract is up draft a young guy and let Smith mentor him. Farrior is getting closer, draft a younger guy and have Farrior mentor him. Hampton is aging and Hoke, get a young guy and have them mentor him. Keisel isn’t young but is havnig one of his best years with the team, have him mentor someone.
You don’t just get young guys plug them in and let them struggle for a year and be back in the thick of things. They would struggle for a couple years, destroy all confidence and we could start over again. Rebuilding our defense by plugging in all Rookies and second year guys as you seem to what would be ludacris and destructive to the organization. You need veteran leadership to help guide them.
The Pats are doing it, but look how they did it. Bruschi and Seau were there and Seau is with Mayo. Rodney Harrison was there with Meriweather. Alot of their D-line have been there for years; they drafted to rookie DTs and they are learning from Wilfork before getting thrown in there. They have veteran DBs helping the younger guys. The Bengals also have young pieces in place, but they didn’t get rid of all their starters when they came in. Bryan Robinson, Justin Smith, and Sam Adams were there to help Peko, Geathers and Fanene. Dexter Jackson and Deltha O’Neal were there to help Hall and Joseph.
If you want to rebuild our D we better also get rid of Harrison since he is 31, Troy since he is 28 and one of your earlier posts I believe said he wouldn’t play into his 30s. Taylor should also go since he is 29 and is slowing down. Fox is 27 and will start to show signs of slowing down as well pretty soon better find his replacement.
by redmik on Dec 8, 2009 12:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If either Burnett or Lewis can start at CB next year, we have the other one plus Gay as the nickel and dime backs in place of Townsend and Carter. That should definitely be an upgrade. All we need is one of the drafted CBs to be a starter. But you are right that we probably need two FS so we can dump Clark and Carter. I think we draft one and sign a relatively cheap free agent who can hold the fort until the new guy is ready. I agree that we need depth at DE and LB, but that can come in the lower rounds. No need to panic.
All things considered
‘08 is looking like an awful draft. Even with Rashard playing well and not writing off Sweed and Tony Hills as outright busts, it doesn’t look great.
But I don’t think that puts the team in to a massive rebuilding. Other than the secondary (which does need a massive rebuild), I’d say every other unit on the roster looks like it doesn’t need more than the annual add some depth/tweak.
You need to give the youngs guys to actually learn the defense instead of jumping all over them for not contributing right away. Hood is a rookie learning one of the most complex defenses in the league as are Burnett and Lewis. Mundy is a second year player. Give the guys a chance. If I recall right people were calling Troy a bust after he didn’t contribute his first year and look what he has become. Name the last rookie defender to come into LeBeau’s defense and make immediate contributions?
Yea, the 2008 draft isn’t looking good, but no team hits on every pick in every draft. We found a stud RB, our backup QB, Mundy who still is learning the D, and don’t write of Sweed. He hasn’t been able to catch the ball, but that is fixable and he should get shot Thursday to redeem himself with Ward likely out the way it sounds.
The last three drafts have yielded five starters to this point, Mendy, Timmons, Woodley, Gay, and Sepelvuda. Wallace has proven a capable receiver for us, Johnson looks like a good player. The majority of the rest are defensive players still learning.
So instead of jumping all over everyone, have some patience and see what develops. And if you think you can do better go apply for Kevin’s job.
Rebuilding?
Where were you when Katrina hit?
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
actually I was in the astrodome
until 2 in the morning every night for a couple months taking care of the mentally ill (gee Marvy while you were probably busy making your bed in your mom’s basement), and my grown children live in New Orleans. any other smart ass questions, son?
Oh! that's where...
…this rebuilding fixation comes from.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
….and a cooler for my beer!
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 8, 2009 5:34 PM EST up reply actions
Steelers may not be kicking, but they are alive
Very thoughtful analysis of the Polamalu factor. Essentially what it boils down to is that with Polamalu, the Steelers are a Super Bowl team; without Polamalu, Steelers are the Cleveland Browns.
I’m not sure I buy that completely, but I’ll combine that with your excellent thoughts that there is a lot of fun left in figuring out how the guys can still get into the playoffs. Starting, of course, with the premise that the can beat Cleveland without Polamalu, and then with Polamalu back on the field, they beat Green Bay, Balt, and Miami. Himmmm. Well, that is bottom line, they have to win all their games. So that we have to assume.
Ten wins should be enough.
Jacksonville will finish 9-7 if they lose 2 of 3 games to Miami, Indy, and Pat. Should happen.
Dolphins are 9-7 or worse if Steelers beat them.
Jets are 9-7 or worse if they lose one game to Atlanta, Indy or Cincy.
Ravens are no better than 10 if Steelers beat them. 9-7 if they lose to GB, Bears, or at Oakland.
Broncos are no better than 10 if they lose at Indy and at Philly.
So, multiple scenarios all dependent on Steelers winning out. If they do, very good chance they get a playoff game.
Could happen.
"More than 70 percent of putts left short do not go in."
But it's like the Raiders game yesterday.
Even if the Steelers had managed to pull the game out yesterday, it was pretty obvious by the 4th quarter that this team isn’t going anywhere this season. You can’t beat the Bears, the Chiefs, the Raiders, the Bengals (twice), you have no business in the playoffs anyway.
If we win out I think we deserve the playoff berth we get
"Now that I'm here, I don't want to just be here, I want to be here for a long time." Hines Ward, 1998 4th round draft pick.
by kick him in the head on Dec 7, 2009 2:09 PM EST up reply actions
Sure we'll deserve it if we win out.
But I doubt we’ll get anywhere near another SB the way this team is playing.
My Two cents
I think that our secondary was our defensive weakness last year and the way LeBeau’s defense is designed, it puts a lot of pressure on the corners. Which may be ok if you have a healthy Polamalu but we don’t so maybe Lebeau deserves some blame for not adjusting in the absence of Polamalu? So here is why I see us falling off from last year.
1. The drop off from McFadden to Gay as starters may not be large but now we have Townsend as our third corner and the drop off between Gay and Townsend could be considerable.
2. This difference is magnified by the loss of Polamalu. If you assume that the secondary is our weak spot on defense, but is “hidden” by the presence of Polamalu.
3. The difference between Polamalu and Tyrone Carter. Another huge drop off here at our weak link on D.
4. That combined by the fact that we are getting no lucky breaks I think makes for the difference in 3 games. Some games are decided by dumb luck. Burnett not making that catch?
If we win only those three games we are 9 and 3 and having a completely different conversation.
I’d be interested in hearing the opinions of someone who knows more about defensive coaching about whether they Lebeau should make changes to the D given that Polamalu is out.
Defensive issues and coaching
Actually, LeBeau’s defense does not put a lot of pressure on the corners compared to other teams and other schemes. That said, all defenses have multiple zone, man and man/zone calls where coverage assignments are different. Then, the huddle call may be changed or adjusted in real time based on offensive formation, personnel group or motion.
The bottom line for the defense is this: Polamalu is the only DB they have who is a pure man to man guy but he plays safety. Ike shows flashes but also is inconsistent, isn’t good in the air and also shows poor tackling here and there. After these two guys, you have mediocre to terrible personnel. Where do the Steelers put their big money – offensive skill positions, Troy and the linebackers. This leads to the next issue….
The base scheme is designed to allow the DBs to play a lot of zone coverage while pressure is applied with the front 7 by use of the zone blitz – that is their base defense. The issue – none of their DEs other than Smith are very good pass rushers. Smith is out, so you have the same scenario as the DBs – they have one dynamic player but he is unavailable. They don’t have to be great, as long as the LBs can help apply the pass rush….
The linebackers – as a group they are not getting the sacks, hurries and turnovers that they need to make the defense great. They are rated well against the run but they is increasingly because they are vulnerable vs the pass. Why bother running it when you can throw it against that secondary? I even question how good they are against the run at this point – when they have to get a stop against a good team, they struggle to do that now as well. Ray Rice showed that they are not the Steel Curtain right now.
The scheme is no longer new and LeBeau is not able to fool people like he used to 10 years ago. All of the blitzes have been on tape for years and everyone prctices against it. Occassionally, you will see a LB or DB come free and get to the QB untouched but that is less common now. You see more man-under or straight man coverage now but the pressure is not consistent enough to put the game away. You sw that the defense had a mis-communication and wrongly sent a blitz from both sides of the ball on the winning TD pass play ysterday. Well, they had an extra blitzer but did not get to the QB in time. They can’t cover man to man very well or even tackle well reacting to the ball when playing zone. If you can’t sack the QB and can’t cover real well you are in real trouble.
I think they need to play even more aggressively on defense. They have proven they can’t cover when rushing 3, 4 or 5 guys. May as well send 6 or 7 and see what happens. May as well get to work against Cleveland…..
"Franz" in NoCal
This isn't a scheme problem, it's a personnel problem, particularly the secondary minus Troy P.
As a secondary, you either have to make plays or have journeyman QB’s throw three TD passes against you in the 4th Q in a game that your playoff lives depended. Shameful display of football, if you ask me, which you didn’t.
Personnel - yes
Agreed. That’s what I was trying to say, specifically within the scheme chosen.
LeBeau’s genius or tactics or whatever you want to call it can’t make up for their poor players.
Only really special players like Polamalu, Smith and James Harrison can tip the scales in your favor. Anyone see the Texas-Nebraska game?? Nebraska’s Suh dominated the game from the DT position. When you have a guy like that, the other guys on the unit can look a whole lot better.
"Franz" in NoCal
Agree that it is a personnel problem
Remember after the Patriots fiasco in 2007 when Bill Belichick basically told the whole world that Anthony Smith just wasn’t a good safety? Sure, some of it might have been that Smith opened his mouth before the game, but while his motivations might not have been pure, Belichick wasn’t lying.
When the coach of the Oakland Raiders says in his postgame comments that they felt they had a favorable matchup against our corners (and let’s keep in mind that the Oakland Raiders receivers were Louis Murphy, Chaz Schillens and some other guys sure to fade quickly in to obscurity), that should translate in to something like this:
An open letter to the Pittsburgh Steelers:
Dear Rooney Family, Kevin Colbert, Mike Tomlin and the rest of the Steeler organization:
Thank you kindly for your hospitality over this past weekend in your lovely city. We enjoyed our visit immensely and would treasure the opportunity to host a similar engagement with your team in our home. Oh, and by the way, your secondary couldn’t stop a passing attack by a school for blind little people.
Eternally yours,
T. Cable
the worst thing is that there's no retort for this
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
i think it's both
its a personnel problem primarily…but lebeau didnt do anything during the game to try to cover up this personnel problem. best way would be bring 6 or more ppl on a blitz on occasion to hopefully get a sack and make it too far for the raiders to convert. too bad he never did it the entire 4th quarter
Also,
It seems to me the problem is clearly in the secondary where in the 4th Qtr, we lose the games even though everyone knows they are going to throw the ball.
Rookie CB J. Burnett to make first NFL start for W. Gay; rookie CB K. Lewis might start over Ike, Tomlin says
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09341/1019081-100.stm
Listened to his press conference and Tomlin says the Steelers are an "average football team" right now and that average might be generous.
Says that Hines might be out Thursday (M. Wallace would make his first start) and that Charlie Batch will be fitted with a soft cast to see if he can be the 3rd QB on Thursday. Tomlin didn’t say this, but if Batch can be the 3rd QB, look for them to cut Palko and then resign Sean McDonald since there would only be 3 healthy WR’s on the roster if Ward can’t go.
Personally, I doubt if Tomlin would bench Ike and go with two rookies at CB. I do question the speed of Joe Burnett, considering the 12-yard cushions he regularly give WR’s when he lines up. Lewis is a better bump and run corner than Burnett, but we’ll see how this plays out. He never mentioned Deshea’s name during the press conference, so what does that say about him?
Post-Gazette reporter said S Ryan Mundy might make his first start replacing Carter or Ryan Clark. Seems achanges are afoot. Thoughts?
Bring on the changes
I know it’s theoretically possible that we can still make the playoffs, but come on – it’s not like we would go anywhere this year. The best I can hope for is squeaking into the playoffs, playing & beating down the Bungles (with or without Troy), and then a respectable loss to the Colts. No “7th Heaven” this year, though. No way.
Play the youngsters, get them some (more) experience, and see what they’ve got. That includes throwing to Sweed multiple times in a game, unless it’s a really close one in the fourth quarter. Then forget about it – throw it to Heath. All in all, it couldn’t be that much worse than what we’ve seen lately [knocks on wood].
If nothing else, it should help the FO make more well-informed decisions when it comes to the offseason and the draft. I think it’s quite obvious at this point that certain people – players and coaches – have got to go.
by SteelerFanInPatsieLand on Dec 7, 2009 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
play sweed
if we’re up by atleast 35 going into the fourth quarter
"Now that I'm here, I don't want to just be here, I want to be here for a long time." Hines Ward, 1998 4th round draft pick.
by kick him in the head on Dec 7, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions
How Sweed It Is !!
Play him and force him to compete for half the game. If he can’t or won’t deliver, then he is gone in the off-season. He has been an incredible disappointment thus far. may as well put it to bed now and move on with or without him.
"Franz" in NoCal
Re: speed of Joe Burnett
I didn’t DVR the game, so I apologize if I’m wrong about this. I thought I saw Burnett (#27) run back toward Logan on the opening kick off to fake a reverse. He was running full speed, to make it look like he might get the ball. That took him at least ten yards past Logan, running in the wrong direction. Then, near the end of the play, #27 flashes back into the screen, presumably trying to catch up to the play and provide a block. Maybe I’m wrong and it was #37, A. Madison? But if I’m right, Burnett is faster than Logan, at least over 80+ yards.
The post above was in response to datruth's comment
don’t know how it ended up down here
I did record the game yesterday
and had a look, and by gum you are right – that was Burnett at both ends of the play. Interesting.
by momma rollett on Dec 7, 2009 7:10 PM EST up reply actions
Thanks for verifying
That means one of two things: either Burnett’s speed should not be a concern, or Logan’s should be!
Browns Win or Lose
Will the streak of losing end here. Will Quinn pick apart the secondary and the streak continue. ??
Browns will lose
Mendy gonna run for 70 yards and spin for an additional 70
"Now that I'm here, I don't want to just be here, I want to be here for a long time." Hines Ward, 1998 4th round draft pick.
by kick him in the head on Dec 7, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions
"Will Quinn pick apart the secondary and the streak continue. ??"
I was just thinking about this. I’ve been patiently waiting for quinn to get his taste of the Steelers Defense. But now I’m not so confident, which is pathetic. This Steelers team could lose to ANYONE. How long is the streak with the browns, like 15 or something? I don’t know…
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
Nobody Asked But...
- No surprises. The Steelers are who they are. This title defense was even more disappointing than 2006. At least in 06 the Steelers hadn’t won a title in 26 years, didn’t know what to expect and had the "excuses" of a QB that suffered a major motorcycle crash and a head coach on the way out the door.
- There is much to be worked on between now and the season’s end as well as much to be fixed between the playoffs (which the Steelers will watch from their living rooms) and July in Latrobe PA.
- Rashard Mendenhall has proven to be a legitimate #1 pick and #1 back. Willie Parker will earn a bigger payday somewhere else in 2010 and either Redmon or a draft pick will have to pick up the slack as the "change of pace" back. To FWP all Steeler fans should say “thank you.” FWP helped earn 2 rings carrying the pigskin until the wheels fell off. The 75 yard XL TD and the 146 he hung on SD in last years playoffs will go down as HUGE games in Steeler lore along with Stallworth’s large Lombardi catches in XIV and Franco’s 156 on the Vikes.
- Ryan Clark should also be thanked for his service but shown the door. He has clearly lost a step. I was very surprised at how great Clark played last year after losing a spleen in Denver in 07. The incident has finally caught up. Father Time (still undefeated) has also claimed DeShea Townsend who can no longer keep up. Bless Ty Carter who tries hard but he was never a physical specimen and he is close to the end of his time in the NFL too. Life after Farrior will be upon us soon too.
- Got to hope Burnett and Keenan Lewis are for real CBs. Time to see what they got. The Steelers would also be well suited to go get a CB and a S early in the draft and rebuild the porous secondary, which minus Troy Polamalu seems devoid of talent.
- I also believe the Steelers will need to sign Casey Hampton. The Big Snack has been an important part of the defense and even this year has performed admirably. I have to believe for many of the defensive 4th quarter meltdown’s this year Snack was on the bench as the nickel/dime gave up big play after big play. There is no one that can do what Hampton does on the roster and a first year NT would be manhandled in the AFCN.
- The FO has always been held in high esteem. They must also take the responsibility for mistakes and step up and get better. Clearly William Gay is not ready to play starting CB and McFadden should have been retained. Gay will hopefully improve but I think the Steelers need a shut down corner in the draft. Mundy is not an NFL caliber safety. I am not sure he is an NFL caliber special teams guy either. Guys like Andre Frazier, Pat Bailey and Don Woods that performed so admirably last year on ST seem to have lost the "edge" and even ex Steeler and current Raider Gary Russell had several good returns to near midfield yesterday.
- The Steelers must also get themselves an offensive identity in 2010. It would be a good place to start to find one between now and the end of 2009. There is no rhyme or reason to the Steelers offense. It is simply to put Ben in a no huddle and let him wing it or just throw deep and wait for the big play. 2 play drives do not make for balanced offense unless you are the 2007 Patriots*. Even they failed to secure the Lombardi. The Steelers have good players. The O line has begun to grow up and play more consistent. The QB is a winner. The plays are decent. They are just not run in a coherent fashion. This must be fixed.
- The Steelers will fix their defense in 2010. Aaron Smith and Troy Polamalu will be back healthy. Hood and Harris will have a year under their belts and there are 5 solid LBs even if Farrior has started to show signs of aging. Add in a couple young talented ball hawks from the 2010 draft along with a more developed Burnett and Lewis and the 4th quarter can once again become a quarter to be dominated instead of feared.
- The special team unit is the biggest conundrum. There seems to be a lack of talent and will in kick coverage. The kicker (who is up for a new contract) kicks it short, whiffs on tackles, is arrested regularly for public intoxication and has missed some crucial kicks in 09. If they choose not to sign Reed they must find a reliable kicker because the offense doesn’t score TDs in the red zone. It would be nice to find a return man among the young DBs the Steelers must draft. Logan is reliable and has been a step up but lacks that 5th gear and takes up a roster spot. Still, if there isn’t a better alternative he has been a step up or two from Davenport, Russell, Rossum or Coclough.
- All in all Tomlin must face the adversity and keep the Steelers focused on winning a game and staying cohesive. The Steelers can hopefully beat Cleveland 3-2 and move to 7-6. If they can close the season with 2 or 3 wins it will show their heart even if their effort was lacking this year.
- I admit I have been a Sweed basher. Hope he has a big game in Cleveland (1 catch?) with Ward out. Did anyone notice that Ben’s hail mary at games end hit Sweed in the hands? Tough catch, but another one that got away. Benny should have tried to zip it into his face mask.
When You Run The Ball Good Things Happen
Give me another draft like the 09 one, resign Big Snack, extend Tomlin, Woodley, Santonio ...
and have K. Colbert find the next under the radar free agents like Farrior & M. Moore (not the next S. McDonald and K. Ratliff) and this team will be back competing for hardware. The tricky part in all of this is now the Steelers have to draft to first beat the Bengals in the division rather than just the other teams in the NFL. So the emphasis still has to be on both lines and in the secondary.
What is with the Bryant Mcfadden love.....
…..when he returned from injury last season he was a starter on paper only, he was not a every down corner and the defense was better because of the recognition of that fact.
He wanted an every down opportunity and starter money. The error of the FO was Ratliff.
by Marvin, The Paranoid Android on Dec 7, 2009 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
B-Mac was a tough, physical CB that made plays on the ball & was a good tackler
He was a GREAT fit for this “D” when he was on the field. Gay doesn’t fight receivers for the ball, doesn’t make a play on the ball when it is in the air and has shown that he isn’t an NFL caliber CB.
I always thought that BMac would be better than Ike (maybe this year if he would have stayed) because BMac could at least catch the ball and was aggressive going after it. He also didn’t give those huge cushions that Gay did. Yes, I am one of those who really liked McFadden. If he were here, we wouldn’t be looking at having to spend a no. 1 pick on a corner next year in the draft where the CB quality and depth is pretty suspect. He was a better fit here than he is in Arizona.
Does anyone know
if Taylor missed the call or made the wrong read on the last play? Apparently he wasn’t supposed to blitz, so how does that happen? Is it because he didn’t know his responsibility or because he doesn’t know the play called?
Any insight as to what happened there?
Premature
If you go into week 13 with 3 straight losses, with a must win game against OAK at HOME and lose, it would be foolish to think that the team as a whole, coaches, as well as individual players will not be questioned or criticized.
But this same team won 4 games in a row earlier in the season, two of those wins against good teams (DEN, SD).
I will reiterate a previous post. This season is not over. With the return of Troy vs. GB at home, we can win. Certainly if we can take BAL to overtime on the road with the 3rd string QB, we can win at home vs. BAL. We are the best run stopping team in the league, certainly we can win at MIA with Henne at QB. Keep in mind these games we have blown have been so close, why couldn’t we win these final 4 especially with Troy back and hopefully back to stay? (notice i don’t even mention thursday’s game.)
So predicated on the Steelers winning out with their healthy SS, we can still unleash hell in december (and first sunday of january):
DEN – we have the tie breaker, so they simply need to lose 2 of their 4 games (included in those games is @IND, OAK, @PHI, KC, with IND/PHI clearly still fighting at those points)
JAX – we will miserably lose the tiebreaker with them based on conference record. they would need to lose two games (included here is MIA, IND, @NE, @CLE (NE will CLEARLY still be fighting at that point)
and thats it folks! No other teams will be a factor. Here’s why:
BAL – they will lose at Lambeau tonight (be serious now), and even if they win their 2 “gimme” games, we play them wk 16
MIA – even if they win out until the end, we play them @MIA wk 17)
NYJ – even if they win out all 4 games with their injured QB Sanchez, we would tie for conference record, we would tie for common games record, we would then win out based on strength of victory
I of course new all this before the OAK loss was finalized, as I was constantly switching to HOU@JAX, praying that HOU would pull it out, missing much of the stupid steeler game.
So the bottom line is, if either JAX or DEN goes 2-2, we’re in.
Think about it. Given the fact that we play 2 of the other teams fighting for this thing (MIA, BAL), we would’ve probably had to win out EVEN IF we beat OAK. I don’t think enough people understand this. Our conference record STILL wouldn’t have touched JAX’s conference record, EVEN IF we beat OAK.
the offseason is the time to consider if our depth at CB is the future.
by SteelCityMafiaNewOrleans on Dec 7, 2009 3:03 PM EST reply actions
Does anyone realize.....
that in another example of absoutely pathetic play calling and game calling strategy that Rashard Mendenhall went from around the TWO minute mark in the first quarter until the 12 minute mark in the third quarter without even touching the football? That’s right…..Mendenhall didn’t even TOUCH the ball for the ENTIRE second quarter. This against one of the worst run defenses in the NFL.
by baabaablacksheep on Dec 7, 2009 3:20 PM EST reply actions
Wow
All I can say is wow. I didn’t get a chance to see the entire game, but what I did see really didn’t look good (obvious statement of the day).
For those questioning whether Lebeau still has it, stop it. You seriously think that he forgot how to coach in less than a year? It’s the execution, not the coaching.
Gay probably has officially lost his starting spot. Burnett and Lewis (and whoever else we pick up next year) will be battling for that spot from now on.
I know Mundy had a bad game, but I would like to see how he does at FS for an entire game. He’s played in spurts, but really hasn’t had the chance to show if he can put it together for an entire game. I know the secondary is bad, but at this point I am willing to try anything until Troy gets back. Tomlin, being a secondary coach himself, will not tolerate this so expect him to change some things in the offseason.
As far as heads rolling, Ligashesky is probably as good as gone. Tomlin has pretty much had to do his job for him the past three years. Arians will probably stay because Ben likes him. But if he costs us a game due to a bad play call or calls (like he already has) I think Tomlin has to give it a serious thought. It’s unfortunate, because the Steelers hardly ever have that much turnover in staff.
We most likely will miss the playoffs. I don’t see us running the table with how we’re playing.
Polamalu
Doesn’t anyone see the problem with putting all of your eggs in the Polamalu basket?
If 43 was in we’d have won x number of games.
Polamalu only really plays in 6 to 8 games every season. He is a warrior and plays like a kamikazi but that is why he is hurt for 1/2 season every year. There are big problems ready to show thier ugly heads in Sixburgh.
Steelers Playoff Chances- Pretty Good
Updated playoff picture. I’m feeling upbeat today about things. Time to move on from the weekend!!! Must say the conclusion of this season should be a fun ride…I love this stuff!
It’s simple for our boys:
1) Win out and get a little help. Beat the Browns Thursday (we aren’t that bad, sorry, we aren’t) without Troy and Hines (he’s got a hurt hammy), win the final three with a healthy Troy and Hines and a hyped up home crowd around Christmas. Face it, this team is different with him and will win the games that count. You don’t think they will get a mental boost when he returns against Green Bay. I am counting down the days! I would be shocked if they lost another game. A Baltimore loss at GB tonight helps greatly and will get things running smoothly and I think it will happen.
Either of the following:
2) Root for Jacksonville to lose 2 of their last 4. They play at Indy and at New England and against Miami in that stretch. The Steelers are +41 in point differential this year, Jacksonville is -48 and 2-4 on the road. They stink just as much as we do but worse and with a full, healthy team. Even if they pull off the miracle and win those games, there is another scenario.
OR
3) Root for Denver to lose 2 of their last 4. They play at Indy and at Philly. Would be surprised if they won either of those.
4) If you are wondering why I have not mentioned some of the teams on the bottom of the list with the same record as the Steelers, here goes: A head to head Steelers win over the Dolphins on 1/3/10 will knock them out as will a head to head over the Ravens 12/27/09 (provided they lose to Green Bay tonight or Chicago on 12/20/09). The Jets will not win their last four with a hurt rookie qb.
2 Spots Open
Broncos (8-4)
Dec 13 @ Indianapolis 1:00 PM CBS L 8-5 WANT THIS LOSS!
Dec 20 Oakland 4:05 PM CBS W 9-5
Dec 27 @ Philadelphia 1:00 PM CBS L 9-6 WANT THIS LOSS!
Sun, Jan 3 Kansas City 4:15 PM W 10-6
Current Conference: 6-3
Predicted Final: 10-6, Predicted Conference: 8-4, Steelers Own Head to Head Tie-Breaker
Jaguars (7-5)
Sun, Dec 13 Miami 1:00 PM W 8-5 WANT THIS LOSS!
Thu, Dec 17 Indianapolis 8:20 PM NFL L 8-6 WANT THIS LOSS!
Sun, Dec 27 @ New England 1:00 PM L 8-7 WANT THIS LOSS!
Sun, Jan 3 @ Cleveland 1:00 PM CBS W 9-7
Current Conference: 6-2
Predicted Final: 9-7, Predicted Conference: 8-4
Ravens (6-5)
Mon, Dec 7 @ Green Bay 8:30 PM ESPN L 6-6 WANT THIS LOSS!
14 Sun, Dec 13 Detroit 1:00 PM FOX W 7-6
Sun, Dec 20 Chicago 1:00 PM W 8-6
Sun, Dec 27 @ Pittsburgh 1:00 PM CBS L 8-7
Sun, Jan 3 @ Oakland 4:15 PM W 9-7
Current Conference: 6-4
Predicted Final: 9-7, Predicted Conference: 7-5
Steelers (6-6)
Thurs, Dec 10 Cleveland 8:20 NFL W 7-6
Sun, Dec 20 Green Bay 1:00 PM FOX W 8-6
Sun, Dec 27 Baltimore 1:00 PM CBS W 9-6
Sun, Jan 3 @ Miami W 10-6
Current Conference: 4-5
Predicted Final: 10-6, Predicted Conference: 7-5
Dolphins (6-6)
Sun, Dec 13 @ Jacksonville 1:00 PM CBS L 6-7
Sun, Dec 20 @ Tennessee 1:00 PM CBS W 7-7
Sun, Dec 27 Houston 1:00 PM CBS W 8-7
Sun, Jan 3 Pittsburgh L 8-8
Current Conference 4-4
Predicted Final: 7-9, Predicted Conference: 6-6
Jets (6-6)
Sun, Dec 13 @ Tampa Bay 1:00 PM CBS W 7-6
Sun, Dec 20 Atlanta 1:00 PM FOX W 8-6
Sun, Dec 27 @ Indianapolis 4:15 PM CBS L 8-7
Sun, Jan 3 Cincinnati W 9-7
Current Conference: 5-5
Predicted Final: 9-7, Predicted Conference: 6-6
Does anyone blame me for turning my at least part of my love over to the Saints this year?
I always liked them, and I have the same man-crush on Drew Brees that Blitz does. It’s just fun watching the Saints play and how they find ways to win this year. Kinda like a certain team last year….. Starts singing Yesterday
Were allowed one team on the NFC side too right?
We will unleash Hell in December.
-Mike Tomlin
i agree with much of the analysis, but much of the steelers problems are mental
Not relaying plays on D is inexcusable. Its happened a number of times now in do or die situations. Lack of mental focus.
Players and coaches are resting on their collective laurels a bit too much. You were good last year. Like blitzem said above, steelers aren’t hungry this year. You expect that from poor teams like the raiders but can’t expect to win without the desire.
I do think that injuries, inexperience, lack of some quality, poor execution, and poor coaching/play calling all have played a part in these losing efforts.
The coaching staff and team are hopefully getting the wake up call. The NFL isn’t easy.
by pixburghese on Dec 7, 2009 6:36 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Ed Reed out tonight for Baltimore
So now we have even more in common. Looks like we will be fighting for bragging rights rather than playoffs when we meet in 3 weeks.
You have to hate losing more than you love winning.
just remember there are 4 games left
you ravens fans are either crying or crowing too early. One or the other.
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
which game did we lose with polamalu in the lineup?
if you mean the second cinci game- he left within the first 5 minutes of the game if i remember correctly….
by steel.curtain.number2 on Dec 7, 2009 7:45 PM EST reply actions
Ya but it counts as a start "stat-wise"
Put an asterisk by it when you see it.
Temporary Saints fan.
The Steelers will be better off in 2010 and beyond because of the growing pains that their youngsters are going through this year. William Gay, Ryan Mundy, Joe Burnett, Ziggy Hood, Stefan Logan – all these guys will be better because of all the experience they’re accumulating this year.
Amen, brother. Amen. In particular, I vote for keeping William Gay. He’s a liability at the moment, but I think there is a high likelihood he will develop into a threat further on down the line.
Repeat after me people, Gay is a FS ... Gay is a FS ...
He’s not a corner. At the best, he might be a starting caliber free safety. At the worst, he’s a backup safety who can contribute on special teams and be a standout gunner like he was with A. Madison this past year.
He just shouldn’t be a starting corner in the NFL.
And since Tomlin is playing the youngsters now, shouldn’t my boy Sunny Harris get some run, too? I betcha he’d at least play as well as Ziggy has and I bet he’d probably make a few more plays.
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