Hines Ward On Super Bowl XLIII MVP Santonio Holmes

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 4:19 PM EST Comment 33 comments

For longer standing readers and participants here at BTSC, you're well aware of my unwavering support of Santonio Holmes earlier in the year. There were reasons to be a bit underwhelemed and disappointed in Holmes at various points along the way this past regular season. There were some drops; there were no big statistical outburts like the one he came through with in the biggest game of the year on Sunday; and of course, there was the unfortunate run in with the police, a lapse in judgment that made some question if Holmes had what it takes to elevate himself into that #1 type WR threat for this offense this year and in years to come.

Part of the reason I wasn't so concerned was that Holmes is just so talented - more so than Limas Sweed who I also think will be fine in the grand scheme of things. But the other reason is the work ethic, which Hines Ward confirmed in an interview with M&M on ESPN Radio Tuesday morning.

'I couldn't be happier for him. The kid just works his tails off. I know he wanted to have a big year. But I told him, your only as good as your opportunities. Don't really look at your stats. Im not really big on stats. Stats are really for fantasy football players.'

Sounds a little bit like something Coach Mike Tomlin would say, does it not?? Man, imagine that!? What if Hines were interested in coaching somewhere down the road after he hangs up his cleats for the final time in the future. For now, let's just be thrilled that our talented young WR Holmes has Hines around as a player to help him, to believe in him, and to set the bar as high as possible in terms of work ethic. THAT my friends is why Hines is worth his large contract status. Even if his statistical output may not match the contract, he brings out added value in everybody around him. Truly a once in a lifetime player for all the various things he brings to the table.

Listen here

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I haven’t been able to say enough about this guy all year! And that my friend, is why I rock his Jersey!!!!!!!!!!!! I tried to get the girl to go Holmes, but she has a thing for Troy.

by Cdsumm on Feb 4, 2009 4:57 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

hehe, nice thanks for sharing

P is so popular with the ladies.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 5:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

There were rumors that Hines might need surgery on that bad knee of his

If so, i hope he ends up o.k., we’ll need him at his best if we wanna defend our title.

by steelersfan86 on Feb 4, 2009 6:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Great post

Hines is totally worth the money. Yes he is a great leader, but lets not forget that he was a definite asset on the field this year. He was our best receiver. He made many of the big plays in the big moments of the big game. He also changes the tone for the Defense whenever he is on the field. DB and LBs play with their head on a swivel when Hines is in.

Love the love he has for Santonio. I hope he can mentor Sweed as well. By the looks of the block he made during the championship game, he already has.

by SteelerBuddha on Feb 4, 2009 7:18 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

oh for sure

his numbers were fantastic this year! il take 1k yards any and all days of the week

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 7:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

One other thought

Somebody posted the ages of all of our players earlier. Sweed and Tone are both 24. Washington is 25. I thought that was interesting considering how much further along tone is in his development. I do think that an improved O-line and diminished role for Ward might mean a pro-bowl trip for tone next year. Of course it will help a great deal if either Sweed or Nate come along a bit.

by SteelerBuddha on Feb 4, 2009 7:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

yea

yet another reason why theres every reason to be so excited about Holmes. Has at least 7-8 more years of excellent football provided he stays healthy.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 7:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Also, Nate came from a very small school. Not only does he not have the physical gifts Tone had, but he was also far behind in the coaching department. Nate will never be Santonio.

Don't worry about the haters. Haters only hate.

by steelguy99 on Feb 5, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Beg to differ

Nate has greater physical gifts. Taller, faster, jumps higher. His upside is much greater.

by worldtrip on Feb 5, 2009 11:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

whooa dunno about that

Nate has plenty of physical tools. But to say his upside is much greater than Nate’s seems way off to me. Steelers dont move up to get WRs in Round 1 with ceilings that are capped at age 24 years old. Santonio is nowhere near done improving and he is much, much more physical and a ton better at concentrating in traffic over the middle. Nate’s a one trick pony more or less on the perimeter. He’s good at what he does, but he’s not at all versatile like Holmes, who goes deep, catches slants, fields punts, etc

by Blitzburgh on Feb 5, 2009 11:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I think what worldtrip means is that his potential ceiling is much greater because his demonstrable “measurables” are better than Tones.

When I compared their attributes everything (taller, faster, jumps higher) completely slipped my mind because I’ve been going by what I see on the field. Nate can jump higher, etc., but it’s Tone I see going up for the catch and bringing it down in traffic. Nate probably does have a higher ceiling in terms of tangibles, but the likelihood that he will hit his ceiling seems far below Santonio’s likelihood. Right now Santonio has better awareness after the catch (a gigantic intangible) and better ball skills. Nate may be able to develop the latter, but not the former.

Don't worry about the haters. Haters only hate.

by steelguy99 on Feb 5, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Right

Yeah, I probably overstated in saying his upside is “much greater”. And I certainly do not think that Holmes has hit his ceiling. And I do agree that the likelihood that Nate hits his ceiling and in effect passes Holms is not great. But boy if he does, watch out.

To make a comparison, and potentially start another debate, Lynn Swann from USC was a much better wide receiver coming out of college vs John Stallworth from Alabama A&M. But by the end of their careers, I think Stallworth was the better player.

by worldtrip on Feb 5, 2009 12:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Tangibles vs. talent

Trip I know where you’re coming from on this one because I’ve always liked Nate and think he is capable of further improvement. He’s a good athlete still learning what it takes to be a good receiver. But I think you’re wrong when you say Nate has “greater physical gifts” because he is taller, faster and jumps higher. “Talent” is a physical gift too, and Santonio simply has more talent as a “football” athlete than Nate. Santonio is quicker and has better body control (ie, coordination) getting to the ball and stronger hands if he gets them on the ball. He’s a more powerful athlete than Nate and can catch the ball even when DBs are making contact with him, and will break more tackles because of leg strength and body control. Nate might be faster in a 40-yard straight line, but Santonio is quicker to a designated spot because he makes sharper cuts and better understands when to accelerate. He’s also a better runner after the catch because he has better instinctive elusiveness, a combination of coordination, vision and innate understanding of what he needs to do to avoid being tackled.

I agree with you about Stallworth. He was my favorite Steeler for years and I liked him more than Swan. But while Santonio has the potential to be somewhat similar to Swan, Nate will never get close to being another Stallworth despite a similar body and some of the same physical tools. He just doesn’t have the same “gifts” which would allow him to convert physical tools into football plays. His hands are better than a lot of people give him credit for, but nowhere near good enough to become an elite receiver. The other unmentioned aspects of becoming a better player are not physical: Intelligence, work ethic and heart, the courage to put your body on the line. Those are what put Swan and Stallworth over the top. Holmes and Washington still have a ways to go but Santonio took a big step in the right direction this post-season.

by steeler.lifer on Feb 5, 2009 3:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

Another Longtime Holmes Supporter

Like Hines said, you’re only as good as your opportunities. Tone’s biggest strength is his deep speed and the line play this year just didn’t allow that many opportunities. Probably also why HInes had such a big year: his strength is in the intermediate range. Better line play next year = more production from Holmes.

by CarlWeathersMustache on Feb 4, 2009 8:18 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

A breakthrough post-season

I know Ben will say that he has always had confidence in Santonio but rarely (perhaps never) have we seen it demonstrated so effectively on the field as in the Super Bowl. Throughout the post-season and especially last Sunday, Ben and Santonio were on the same page with their reads and both executed brilliantly in the clutch.

This hasn’t always been the case in the past and the offensive line is only partly to blame. There have been plenty of occasions when, after an incompletion, we’ve seen Ben and Santonio together on the sidelines discussing some kind of miscommunication in reads or route adjustments (the late first-half intercept in the Indy game being one of the more memorable examples). We’ve also seen Santonio have problems with ball control when he goes low to catch a pass, a bobble allowing the ball to touch the ground or Santonio losing it upon contact with the ground. There are reasons unrelated to the O-line that contributed to Holmes being ranked 59th (among the 79 WRs with at least 50 passes thrown to them) by Football Outsiders. Obviously that ranking is way out of line with reality, but one regular season statistic that stands out is that only 48 per cent of all passes that Ben threw to Santonio were completed. That’s one of the lowest figures in the league. Hines was ranked No. 7 overall by FO, a ranking based in part by the fact 65 per cent of passes throw to him were completed. Incompletions happen for a variety of reasons, but the bottom line is that completions lead to trust and more confidence and eventually more passes in clutch situations.

I think we’ve seen the torch passed from Hines to Santonio in this post-season as Ben’s go-to guy. They relied on each other and came through in the most important of situations. Santonio has had a taste of what he is capable of and how good he can be, after earlier in the season having a taste for what happens when you lose focus and let your team down (on and off the field). If he brings the same degree of focus to training camp next year and maintains it for four-five months, he’s going to have a great season and probably many more after that.

by steeler.lifer on Feb 4, 2009 11:22 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

+1

My concern with Tone is his consistency. Last year, he led the league in YAC. When he makes the catch, he makes a big play. But, until recently, he hasn’t always made the catch. My hope is that next year he’ll show us the same production he showed this post season.

I have similar feelings about FWP. When he breaks a run, he goes for a whole lotta yards. However, if you don’t make holes for him, he doesn’t get very far.

With those two as our offensive leaders, we have a ‘big play’ offense. By that I mean an offense that can take it to the house every now and then. But not necessarily a consistent produce-on-every-down kind of offense. Looking to the future, I think we need more players like Heath Miller.

by Varmint on Feb 5, 2009 2:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

thing of the past my friend

He had a few drops early in the year – along with everyone else back then, mind you. No snafus since Dallas game.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 6, 2009 3:26 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I certainly hope you're right

But we’ve seen players fall back to early tendencies before.

by Varmint on Feb 8, 2009 10:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hines Ward -- The Steelers Not So Secret Weapon

You know, I was thinking this was it for Hines. I was saying leading up to the game that if we won the SB, Hines would retire — ala Jerome Bettis. I mean, what more does he need? He owns all of the Steeler’s records. He is a lock for the hall of fame. He owns two rings.

And then watching his reaction after the game — it sure looked like a man who was saying goodbye.

Then I heard his little speech at the rally… and now I’m not so sure… He doesn’t sound like a guy who is retiring… he sounds like he thinks we can get back to the show, and he doesn’t want to leave until he has three rings.

I don’t know if anyone else saw the NFL replay of the Raven’s game, but after the Sweed drop, Hines called him over for a talking to. I don’t think the block that Sweed laid on Corey Ivy was a coincidence.

When 86 calls you by name: “Hey… SWEED. Sweed! Come here!” He gets your attention.

by MarkJoel66 on Feb 4, 2009 8:58 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

hmm

I have heard nothing about him even contemplating retirement. Why might you think that? He had one of his five best pro seasons this year and is only 32 years old. TO is 35, Marvin Harrisons 36, and theres tons more examples of guys playing productive football a number of years older than Hines’ age.

I see him playing at least one more year; more like 3 at least personally.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 9:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Comparisons

I don’t think Hines is ready to retire, either.

But on a completely unrelated point, longevity comparisons with other receivers is a little suspect (my opinion). Hines doesn’t play like TO. He plays more like James Harrison than Marvin Harrison. The man gives his body a beating every season. I love him for it, but the abuse could easily shorten his career.

by Varmint on Feb 5, 2009 2:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

put it this way

I dont think Ward would hurt the team by doing that. He knows that the organization would be screwed in 09 if he werent there. Ok, maybe not screwed. But Tone, and Limas? We’d have to keep Nate for sure and I suppose we could get by with those 3, but I don’t think Hines would leave the team dangling like that if he knew he could still compete. He hasnt had any concussions or anything like that. And he clearly loves the game and is a notoriously wicked competitor. Not sure theres any logic at all that suggests he might be done.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 9:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

It was nothing I heard

Just a feeling… I do think it depends on how badly his knee is hurt.

I don’t know… Hines is a competitor… but after watching the Bus leave a winner, I think a lot of guys were thinking: “Man that’s the way to do it…” And getting to the Super bowl is so hard… did anyone think it would take us four years to get back here again?

I was just thinking he looked like a guy who was thinking about levaing while on top…

But when he said “We’re going to go back and get a seventh Lombardi” I changed my mind…

by MarkJoel66 on Feb 4, 2009 10:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

I mean, I hear ya. I dont think Hines will limp out disgracefully. But I think he’d at least announce his decision to retire at seasons end the year he does do so. He’s a freakin Steelers legend. Cant just disappaer after the fact. I mean, he CAN, but he wouldnt do that to his legions of fans. Not a chance. Unless he was forced to due to injury in a season finale. my two cents

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 10:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hines

I wondered before this game if he might retire if they won. I didn’t think he would, but when you just accomplish your second championship and have been playing for 10 years, a guy might start thinking that way. But, I think he would have said something by now, or someone would have asked him. I think he will play another 3-5 years, barring injury.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 5, 2009 11:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Hines

I can see him playing 3 more PRODUCTIVE years.

I Love the guy!!!

His value is so much more than stats…stats do not win championships!!! Heart and passion win championships…he is 1 of our greatest players and leaders in franchise history!

by SteelerMike on Feb 4, 2009 9:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

woot +1

True Legend.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 4, 2009 9:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You know I think when I see Limas Sweed coming out and laying a block like 2 weeks ago, when I see a younger Tonio doing the same thing, when I see all our receivers willing to go over the middle for the clutch catch (ok except for Sweed yet!) it’s obvious to me Hines is already a coach. He’s just not paid as one yet. I heard a rumour Hines is looking to play the 2009 last year of his contract then hang them up. Personally I hope he doesn’t. If he wants to carry on I think he has a couple of years as a 3rd WR left in him yet and I wouldn’t mind the Steelers offering him a 2 year extension to a) reduce his cap hit and b) keep him on board for a while longer. I am hoping when he does call it a day a vacancy pops up for a WR coach or assistant on the Steelers staff too.

by KiwiSteelerFan on Feb 5, 2009 4:03 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

No Doubt, The HINES impact is huge

Somewhere in the 70s, the Linebackers started a tradition that carries through to this day. It is no accident that the Steelers have sent more linebackers to the pro-bowl than any other team.

Here’s hoping Hines has started a tough and gritty tradition at Wide Receiver. I know Swann was an amazing talent, and Stallworth was huge at YAC… but no one has played the position of Wide Receiver like a STEELER quite like Hines.

Can you imagine if EVERY receiver started hitting like Hines? We could have DBs intimidated when they had to play here.

by MarkJoel66 on Feb 5, 2009 7:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

good thoughts kiwi

Welcome to the site as well.

Hines is definitely a coach already. Funny how TO at age 35 cant command anywhere near that kind of respect from his peers as Hines at 32. Can we pay him as coach and player? :) Surely theres rules in the CBA against that but not entirely positive.

by Blitzburgh on Feb 5, 2009 7:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs