Pittsburgh Steelers Close 2010 NFL Draft With A Bang
by Michael Bean on Apr 24, 2010 9:25 PM EDT
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PrintWow, what a whirlwind of a Saturday for the Pittsburgh Steelers. After spending the first two days fixated on the action, I took a break this morning only to come back and see some outstanding developments.
* There were of course four rounds of drafting to be done by the Steelers and the rest of the league on Saturday. We'll get there, but first, how about the acquisition of cornerback Bryant McFadden from the Arizona Cardinals?!? If you've read here for more than a year, you probably remember how disappointed I was that the Steelers let him get away last year. My reasoning was it just didn't make much sense to develop a 2nd round draft pick only to let him walk when he was in the peak window of his physical prime. Anyway, what's done is done. He's back in Pittsburgh now, and in my mind, this move makes the Steelers defense very, very versatile and deep. You may not think overly highly of B-Mac as a player, but he's great against the run, knows Dick LeBeau's defense and should allow guys like William Gay, Joe Burnett, et al to have to shoulder less of the load than they might be ready for. More on this move later.
* On to the draft picks. First let's go over who they were and were they were selected.
Round 4, Pick # 18 (#116): Thaddeus Gibson, DE, Ohio State
Quick Hit Reaction: Well, well. Looks like the Steelers were much more serious about bolstering their depth and talent at the OLB position. Thaddeus Gibson, like 2nd round draft pick Jason Worilds, was a DE in college that will hopefully be groomed into a menacing pass rusher down the line. For now, Gibson will have a great opportunity at making an impact on special teams. He's quite fast and agile for a man his size so I'd expect him to do a much better job on coverage units than what we grew accustomed to last season.
Round 5, Pick # 20 (#151): Chris Scott, OT, Tennessee
Quick Hit Reaction: Not sure what I think about trying to find talent at such a crucial position in the mid-rounds, but Chris Scott certainly has plenty going for him. He's tall at 6'4" and he apparently has the ability to use his big, strong hands effectively. From the sound of it though, he may lack the natural balance and agility to play left tackle. Or at least that's the knock on him for now. It's hard to say what the Steelers will do with Willie Colon after this year. He's restricted free agent once again, and the Steelers will almost certainly have him start until he gets injured or performs poorly enough to be yanked. Hopefully that doesn't happen though for his and the team's sake. I think it's safe to say that Scott will begin his professional career on the practice squad of the Steelers.
Round 5, Pick # 33 (#164 compensatory): Crezdon Butler, CB, Clemson
Quick Hit Reaction: With the re-acquisition of Bryant McFadden, I don't see anywhere on the roster where Butler could fit in this coming season. Butler is fast, real fast. From what I can tell though, he's raw in terms of football savvy. Who knows, maybe a year or two of work at the professional level will get him ready for life at the NFL level. If nothing else, I think his presence at mini-camps and at Latrobe will push the existing young talent on the depth chart to elevate their games. It will be an open competition between guys like him, Burnett, Lewis, etc., so I wouldn't count him out just yet. But seems like a practice squad addition at best for the immediate future.
Round 5, Pick # 35 (#166 compensatory): Stevenson Sylvester, LB, Utah
Quikc Hit Reaction: I love (changed from I like) this pick in round five by the Steelers. Sylvester is good in pass coverage, quick and instinctual, and is extremely competitive. That seems to be the theme of the draft to me - the Steelers have targeted guys who love to play football and hate to lose. Sylvester was part of some pretty damn good Utes teams during his career in Salt Lake City. Sylvester is apparently not as effective as a blitzer as he is in other facets, but that's okay. ILBs aren't necessarily asked to do too, too much blitzing in LeBeau's schemes, and when they do, it's often in confusing stunts that don't require the LB to do too much but hit his gap at the right moment and at full speed. I'm not sure there's a spot for him this year considering the four guys at ILB - Farrior, Foote, Timmons and Fox. Who knows though. Patrick Bailey and Andre Frazier's days could be numbered if Sylvester looks good from day one in the black and gold.
Round 6, Pick # 19 (#188): Jonathan Dwyer, RB, Georgia Tech
Quick Hit Reaction: The Steelers finally get a fresh body at the RB position by drafting Georgia Tech's Jonathan Dwyer in the 6th round. Great, great value here, as Dwyer was at one time thought of a 1st or 2nd round pick. Some believe that his draft stock plummeted because of him playing slightly out of position at fullback in the triple option offense deployed at GA Tech the past few years. Fine by me if it means Dwyer has been trained to run downhill and not be shy of contact. I think he'll be a nice addition to the running game, in more than one department. I also like that he probably feels like he's got everything in the world to prove to his doubters. Hey, he was on the cover of EA Sports' NCAA Football 2010 - he has to be a stud, right? Great pickup here that I imagine plenty of Steelers fans are excited about.
Round 6, Pick # 26 (#195 from ARI): Antonio Brown, WR, Central Michigan
Quick Hit Reaction: Another highly competitive and productive WR with lots of speed, but not much size. Sounds a lot like the Steelers third round pick Emmanuel Sanders and their third round pick from a year ago, Mike Wallace. Obviously I don't know much about the kid, but you've got to like how experienced he is making plays in the passing game during his collegiate career, and his 4.4 speed certainly jumps out at you. It looks like he also has some experience returning kicks and punts. I wouldn't at all put it past him to make the 53-man roster, but I don't see how both he and Sanders make the squad. May the best man win!
Round 7, Pick # 35 (#242 compensatory): Doug Worthington, DT, Ohio State
Quick Hit Reaction: Running long, but I don't want to dismiss the Steelers final pick of this year's draft as one not worthy of any attention. In fact, I think it's one of the better picks of Saturday. Worthington lacks the type of athleticism to make scouts drool, but on the surface at least, I think he may make a whole lot of sense in LeBeau's 3-4 scheme. He's strong at the point of attack, clogs lanes well, and has no problem at all doing the dirty work so that others behind him can make the plays that show up in the stat book. Sound like anybody we know on the team? Not saying he will become Aaron Smith or Brett Keisel, but he at least fits the bill in terms of his skill set and size. We'll see how Sonny Harris has developed this past year, but I think we'll see either him or Worthington dressing this coming year at the bottom of the DL depth chart.
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BAP rules the day
I love that the Steelers adhered to their philosophy of drafting the best available player. I’ve tried to tell people for months that they’d stick to their proven philosophy, but nobody wanted to listen. Kudos to Kevin Colbert and company!
McFadden
I’m sure you remember me saying that I wasn’t too worried about losing McFadden, and I thought Gay would be fine. In fact, I still don’t think he was as bad as some people have said. But, I’m very happy to get B-Mac in the fold, and I think the Steelers need to go ahead and lock him up for a five year deal.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 24, 2010 9:54 PM EDT reply actions
I agree
with your comments on Bailey. He was not as good as his first year as a rookie in special teams. He looks like a fish out of the water when playing defense. In regards with Arnold Harrison, I was under the idea that he played with Cleveland last season?
Good Draft, I see this team going deep and possibly wining #7
Dwyer!
76% of the survey respondents at this moment voted the same.
(Pouncey + Dwyer) * (Mendenhall + Art Rooney’s comments) = Run the D*** Ball
Bill Beeelichick proved that in America it’s okay to cheat, as long as you cheat your way to the top. – Eric Cartman
well as 50 would say
“When you run the ball, good things happen”
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene and Jerry Kramer
"It's a great day to be a mountaineer, where ever you may be" Tony Caridi
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Apr 25, 2010 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions
They had me confused most of the day...
But, as is most often the case with a Steeler draft, after allowing the meal to settle a bit, I’m quite satisfied. This post speeds the digestion — helps put everything in perspective. Good show.
"Never mistake motion for action." - Ernest Hemingway
Great Saturday (and draft) for the Steelers!
I coudn’t be happier with what we did today. Bringing back B-Mac makes us so much better in the secondary. We couldn’t have found a single corner in the draft who would have the immediate impact in our system that he will. Gibson is a real find in round 4 — he keeps getting better and was the best defensive player on the field in the OSU-Oregon Rose Bowl in January. Dwyer is very exciting. Powerful and explosive. I actually think he’ll push Mendenhall for tailback reps. And that’s the thing about this draft that I love the most — it’s going to really make people compete for jobs. It restores a sense of urgency that may have been missing last year after winning the SB. This feels like a really strong Steeler football team!
"There is no truth but in transit." R.W. Emerson
by cliff harris is still a punk! on Apr 24, 2010 11:52 PM EDT reply actions
Just had a moment to read through the picks descriptions
This afternoon’s been busy with family stuff. I’ve had moments here and there to follow the draft and I’m pretty excited to get B-Mac back. I think I said something like this in the Worilds post, but I think the FO was targeting a lot of players in the later rounds to get the STs back to something approaching respectability this season. Like Michael said, they targeted players that are very competitive and hate to lose. Don’t they say that STs coverage is all about ‘want to’? This draft looks pretty darn good to me. Addressed our two biggest needs in IOL and secondary with Pouncey and trading to bring back B-Mac, and got a ton of competition for our coverage units. Not to mention a player that could be looking to make some noise on the DL down the road for us in addition to Ziggy and Sunny from last year.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 24, 2010 11:54 PM EDT reply actions
Dwyer
Why Dwyer fell so far is a big question. Here in Atlanta, they were talking about that on 790, one of the sports talk stations, speculating that his failed drug test at the combine may have been reason. But, every team in the league was notified that he would fail ahead of time because it was known that he had been taking a prescription which contained an amphetamine since something the like the 5th grade (apparently for ADD or something). But, I think he is a huge value in the 6th round, for sure.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 24, 2010 11:58 PM EDT reply actions
Re: Dwyer
I think teams looked at what he did in that Ga. Tech triple-option scheme and didn’t think it would translate to the pros. He was a glorified dive back who got the ball based on the QB’s read of the defensive end. I don’t think teams thought that would prepare him for things like running zone from the back of the I or picking up blitzes. But I love his running style and I think he’ll compliment Mendy well. Whatever the reason, I’m glad he fell!
"There is no truth but in transit." R.W. Emerson
by cliff harris is still a punk! on Apr 25, 2010 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions
I guess that makes sense, but for a guy who talked about in rounds 1 or 2 dropping to 6? Oh well, I’m with you, glad he fell to us!
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 9:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, in that offense, a lot of times he got the ball after the D was drawn towards someone else (like the QB) and he had some gigantic holes to go through, which he took aggressively. While it worked well in that system, many questioned his speed, as the available time & space in NFL will be much smaller. He wasn’t going to be a first or even second-rounder, but good value in the 6th. If he gets that first block, hopefully should be able to quickly find opening and have the power to break through arm tackles (something Parker was lacking) and then be a load to bring down.
Couple of Random Thoughts
1) Only in Pittsburgh would people complain about having too many pass rushers. Seriously, what a wonderful problem to have.
2) I dig both the Gibson and Worilds picks. I do think you need to look at Worilds junior season to get a statistical idea of what he’s capable of. Like a lot of guys on more or less medicore defenses, his stats suffer because other teams gameplan for him.
3) OSU played a lot of 3-4 on D this year and Gibson has experience at both pass rush 3-4 OLB and a 4-3 DE. So, there’s some experience there and the coaches seemed to like how steady his improvement was on the field once they introduced the new D. He’s great value in the 4th. At that point, OLB was no longer a need, but they simply couldn’t pass him up. Such a Colbert pick.
4) Same goes for the 7th round DE Worthington. He’s got a great frame and long arms without the abiliy to eat space. Like his teammate Gibson, he’s got plenty of experience in a 3-4 – as a DE. This should make the transition a bit easier. Great value there. One thing I take away from this is that the coaches are bullish on Ziggy and Sunny being part of a good DE rotation next year. Otherwise you would expect them to draft a conversion DT a bit higher.
5) Dwyer probably fell due to some concerns about his conditioning (he looked slow and bit dumpy at the combine) and because no one knows exactly how he’ll adjust to a pro style rushing attack. He might be a real steal here though. Could immediately become a nice short yardage back with the potential to be a closer. I think the ill-advised transition to the ZBS is thankfully over.
6) Maurkice Pouncey. Chris Scott. And now Ciron Black. What do all these guys have in common? There’ll all big maulers from the SEC – violent men that want to clear a path for a runner. Tell me this team isn’t getting ready to cram the ball down some people’s throats
All in all, a very unsexy darft. And by that, I mean a very Steeler draft. Beef in the trenches. Pass Rushers galore. And a couple of speedy WR’s. Not bad at all
by BluegrassSteeler on Apr 25, 2010 12:11 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Ciron Black?
Did we sign him as an UDFA, or did I miss him somewhere?
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions
Ciron Black
He is NOT on our roster and a google search shows him as unsigned.
Yup, Black signed about an hour after the draft. Guy could eventually turn into a guard/right tackle. Lack of athleticism killed him during the draft.
by BluegrassSteeler on Apr 25, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Cool, thanks!
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting observations, BgS. I agree.
Re: thought #3- If that’s the case with Gibson, I would compare it to the Mendenhall (fans: “a running back?”… management: “yes, a big, fast, multi-dimensional RB with with killer tape”) pick, or to the Woodley (in spite of having Hagans, Porter, and Harrison the previous year I think) pick.
Re: #4- I’m bullish on Sunny, too.
Re: #5&6- Agreed that based on the players brought in, it appears the offensive line has made some decisions with regard to style and identity – instead of forcing a ZBS style that favors quickness, let the maulers maul, and get some more of them. Also, see my comment just above re: Dwyer
Like Our Picks
I would really like to see Alan Faneca come back and boost our our running game with his blocking. We should have plenty of fresh bodies. Need someone to “push” Snack for some minutes. We need a “beast” in the NT position. Snack gets gassed after a couple of plays.
Our LBs should be the best in the NFL. Also I thing that our “special teams” are going to put some “fear” in teams this year. Hope Czech can take over the kickoff duties and kick the ball out of the endzone. I also think that we will have kick returners who can “take it to the house”. Dixon will represent himself VERY well in Ben’s absence. We need for Sweed to finally get it together. I HOPE that Ben will get it together and get his life under control. This is going to be a good year for us.
Imho
I think Logan had the opportunity to “take it to the house” every single time. I think what kept him from succeeding was only his lack of experience (and probably lack of good assistance) – he has/had the tools, but occasionally he just looked a little lost in which direction to go. I feel a little bad that we probably drafted his replacement after giving Logan a valuable year to gain that experience and learn from it.
True
but Logan was 28, IIRC, last year. If we replace him with someone as good who is 5-6 years younger, so much the better.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Logan will be a blip
He’ll bounce around as a guy who teams sign when they decide mid season they need and instant improvement in their return game.
to BE the man you gotta BEAT the man.
logan aint going nowhere unless one of thes scrub rookies proves themselves by wresting that job from logans cold dead fingers.
and at that point more power to em.
but honestly….with all the rookie special teamers and another year to mesh i wouldnt be surprised to see logan have a pro bowl return year.
Ben is INNOCENT!
love the picks
what I like most is that they swung for the fences on every pick, which means if 2 or 3 hit we’ll all be ecstatic …. and 2 or 3 of these picks are bound to hit it big.
A very small correction but, as a Utah alum, the U Of Utah is in Salt Lake City. I believe there is a small, community college in Provo——BYU or BYO or somethng like that.
whoops!
sorry about that :)
Freel free to email me anytime at behindthesteelcurtain@gmail.com with questions, suggestions, complaints, etc, or to just say what's up. -Michael Bean (Blitz)
by Michael Bean on Apr 25, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions
hopefully sanders gains his "freshman 40"
without losing quickness, because the guy is very very small. hes got to bulk uo with muscle to me effective in the NFL
I would be astounded if the Steelers picked up Faneca. The Chicago Bears on the other hand…
by BluegrassSteeler on Apr 25, 2010 1:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Thanks for breaking down a summary of the picks today. I can’t spend as much time lately keeping up and commenting, but I do still very much appreciate the work put in here. Keep it up guys.
You sure Ike isn’t reacquainting himself with his fingers, he certainly doesn’t use them for catching. - Brian (DaBolts) on "Face Me Ike"
steelguy!
wondered about you lately my man. hope all’s well. holler at me sometime.
Freel free to email me anytime at behindthesteelcurtain@gmail.com with questions, suggestions, complaints, etc, or to just say what's up. -Michael Bean (Blitz)
by Michael Bean on Apr 25, 2010 2:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Oh My Oh My
I still am getting over the fact that Dwyer was still available to us. I wanted us to go after blount because ive been working the past 3 days on and off and i couldve sworn that dwyer was already drafted. I actually choked on my cookie when the selection came up (true story lol ) . I think this kid has a lot of potential and a lot of upside. I know that he ran the ball in a wierd offense but still looking on youtube and watching a couple of his games, this kid’s a gamer. I cannot wait to see him perform in latrobe. I guess with the selections of both receivers , i’m a little twisted on what the team’s gonna do with the rest of the receivers.. I mean we only have a 53 man roster, and we picked up El and battle and now we drafted 2 more talented -semi speedsters. I Guess that’s why I’m here sitting at home and the coaches are doing they’re job lol . Either way I’m excited with the way our draft went and I cannot wait for the upcoming season
In Myron we Trust
thnks man
Good to see you’re alive and well.
Freel free to email me anytime at behindthesteelcurtain@gmail.com with questions, suggestions, complaints, etc, or to just say what's up. -Michael Bean (Blitz)
by Michael Bean on Apr 25, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
On to the UFA's!!
Looks like there’s still some quality talent left over from this deep draft, and here’s a couple guys I’d like for us to try to sign:
Jeff Cottam, TE Tennessee
He’s huge (6’-7" 262lbs), and surprising athletic (4.76 40). He’s been primarily a blocking TE at UT with Luke Stocker (tremendous TE prospect for next year) being the pass catching option. But when given the opportunity, he shows pretty soft hands. He’s should be able to match Spaeth’s catching abilities while bringing an ability and willingness to block.
Tony Washington, T Abilene Christian
I’m sure this won’t happen b/c of his sex offender status, but how often do you get the chance to get a guy with the athleticism to play LT at basically no cost. It seems like a pretty low risk/high reward situation. Plus, I don’t think you can pass on a guy who had a consensual incestuous relationship with his sister. You just don’t find guys like that every day.
Adam Ulatoski, T Texas
C’mon, how great of an O-lineman name is that?
Vince Oghobaase, DE Duke
Big, raw kid that might be worth it to throw on the practice squad for a couple years. He’s been hampered by injuries which has really hurt his draft stock.
Dennis Rogan, CB/S Tennessee
Very athletic player who has played both CB and S at Tennesee. Made a horrible decision to leave a year early, and if someone can stash him on their practice squad for a year or two, they could be the beneficiaries of his mistake. He’s sort of a jack of all trades who tackles well, and even brings some return skills.
Did we miss out on adding depth at S and DT?
overall, I’m pleased with the selections.
- Pouncey will start on day 1 and seems like a good character kid. Thanks to Trai for his service last year, but he’ll return to the 1st G/T backup role this year. Hopefully by 2011, Pouncey takes over at C and we’re set at that position for 10yrs+. Maybe we’ll pick up Pouncey’s twin next year, too!
- I thought OLB depth was a problem, so the additions of Worilds and Gibson (at least one of them) may help that. Worilds will help on ST right away; Gibson is versatile (OLB, DE, either side) and showed good improvement from Sep – Dec last year.
- Sanders is an interesting pick – is he a slot or an outside receiver? Does this move Wallace outside? Regardless, I think we’ll see PLENTY of 4WR sets this year, despite the FOs urging to return to the run game.
- I had hoped that the FO would draft a Safety at some point, at least for depth. bringing BMac back was a great move, but we’re still left with Mundy and Allen backing up Troy and Clark. I also thought we’d pickup one of the big DTs, despite the resigining of Snack. Perhaps next year…
here are a few UDFA possibilities:
Boo Robinson, DT Wake Forest
Jay Ross, DT East Carolina
Joe Pawelek, ILB Baylor
Micah Johnson, ILB Kentucky
Donovan Warren, FS Michigan
Chris Maragos, FS Wisconsin
"If I could start my life over again I would be a pro football player and you damn well better believe I would be a Pittsburgh Steeler!" Jack Lambert Hall of Induction speech 1990
by Throw it Ben! on Apr 25, 2010 8:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Tony Washington
Screwing your sister “was a mistake”?
Wow. I can’t even imagine, given the way yinzers dig in on an awful joke, how the local radio folks would play this. Washington would end up cutting his wrists in a bathtub.
Happy with the Draft...
…but low expectations for a successful 2010 season.
The Steelers need to get younger and faster on defense and on special teams which they did with the three picks at the linebacker position. In the Steeler system, linebacker is most responsible for getting pressure on the quarterback. Remember, their philosophy: Get pressure on the quarterback and you can get away with a lesser defensive backfield.
Jason Worilds was once the second rated DE in this 2010 draft and I believe he will develop into yet another stellar linebacker on a long list of past and current stellar Steeler linebackers. The Steelers chose the best athlete available who also fills a need. Gibson and Sylvester also fit the mold, both competitive, speedy, 240-pounders.
I realize some think we should have addressed the aging defensive line with a high draft pick, but you really do not need youth and speed on the D-line. We have very capable older, immovable objects who can clog holes at this position and some developing youth who were drafted last year.
I am especially pleased with the drafting of Jonathan Dwyer at running back. He looks like another Bus, albeit not ready to step in right away.
My immediate expectations for a successful 2010 season are low unless the Steelers can quickly develop a running game. This is doubtful as the pieces are beginning to come together, but we will begin 2010 with the same O-line and and have lost FWP at running back. After 4-6 weeks of B. Leftwich, D. Dixon and C. Batch at QB, all will enthusiastically welcome back Big Ben.
Off topic: Now there is talk of Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI) with Big Ben. Remember, before the reckless behavior and TBI, there was his parents divorce at the age of two. He lived with his father while his biological mother had visitation rights. At age eight, he was playing catch with his stepmother awaiting moms visit when her car was struck by a truck. She died in the hospital.
So, give the guy a break. Hopefully, with professional help, he can heal mind and body over the next six months, then return to a productive football life.
Great write-up as always Blitz
So excited about Pouncey, Dwyer, Sanders, and Worilds (in that order). I guess you can add McFadden to that, but he is not really a draft pick and we already know what he is capable of. I think I was just as disappointed as you when he left. I saw him play quite a bit at FSU and I always loved his tackling ability. Glad to have him back!
The future is not what it used to be.
What the media did not tell you.
Thanks for the overview!
I’ve been plying soccer mom all week/weekend and I’ve been trying to keep up with the draft mostly by popping in here and reading up. I am extremely happy with how things have shaken out for us. It seems we’ve picked guys who will fit in well with the Steeler way of playing football. I am excited about McFadden coming back and was really pleased when we got Leftwich back before the draft. I feel optimistic about this season! Here we go….
Really good draft
The FO knew that our pass rush tailed off at times last season, so they drafted two hybrid LBs and another guy (Sylvestor) that can possibly play inside. That gives us the chance to spell Harrison and Woodley at certain points in the game. If all three make the team and are good SP players that will also allow Tomlin to take Harrison off of SP.
Why is everybody upset that we didn’t address NT? I think that’s an insult to Hoke, who rarely plays anyway unless Aaron Smith is injured. Most of the time teams are passing the ball against us, so we’ll only have two DLs on the field in our nickel package, neither of which will be Hampton or Hoke. Smith, Keisel, Ziggy, and Eason (when he was here) were on the field in the nickel package the most, so unless Hampton is injured Hoke has relatively fresh legs throughout the season. We can address NT next year.
I was one of the guys advocating that the FO take a corner high. They ended up with an experienced guy who will allow our two young corners to develop further. He’ll be thrown at quite a bit, so hopefully he can play up to his 2008 form.
"Don't Call It A Comeback"
All have good builds for their positions
The one thing I like most about this group is that, except for Brown at WR, they all look like NFLers for their respective positions.
Dwyer, frankly, is a prototype NFL halfback. Short. Tree trunks for legs.
Worthington feels like the real sleeper. The guy looks like a black version of Aaron Smith. If he plays even half as hard as Smith, then he’s a keeper.
I think the people who should be most afraid are James Farrior and Lawrence Timmons. All the OLBs can make the roster. But, they can’t all play OLB. I don’t think Farrior makes the 53-man roster.
Two things I don't understand
(1) We had what, 10 picks in this draft? Half of them are obviously going to be cut. Why not move up and get some impact players?
(2) At numerous points, we picked players that are projected to go much lower. It doesn’t mean that these players are not good, I’m confident that the FO knows which is the player that fits us best. However, this does mean is that with high probability other teams are not going to pick these players for quite a while, hence it is possible to take a more “popular” guy. Let me explain with an example. Say we have a draft with two teams only, Team A and Team B, and we’re only drafting players 1 through 4. Draft picks are A, B, A, B.
Team A’s preferences: 1 > 2 > 3 > 4
Team B’s preferences: 2 > 3 > 1 > 4
In the first round, Team A could take “Best Player Available” with player 1. But that would result with Team A (1,3) and Team B (2,4). However, if Team A realizes that player 1 is not too popular, they can start with 2, and this will end with Team A (1,2) and Team B (3,4).
Specifically, I don’t get why we didn’t:
* Take Golden Tate or Terrence Cody at #52, trade up for Worilds (if necessary) in the third.
* Move up in the 4th for Everson Griffen.
* Move up in the 5th for Ricky Sapp.
What's done is done
If things don’t work out, then we can start second guessing
by barnerburner on Apr 25, 2010 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions
The answer to number 1, I believe, is that while this was a very deep draft, the FO didn’t believe that they would get players in the first 3 rounds that would certainly beat out the starters in most positions. Although we were only 9-7 last year, we still had top offense and defense. However, our special teams coverage was horrible last year. Where do you usually get quality STs? In rounds 4-7, which is why the FO loaded up on these players instead of trading up. The other side is that people that have suggested this seem to assume that we could just trade our non-compensatory picks in rounds 4-7 for 2 or 3 more 2nd or 3rd rounders. The likely best we could have hoped for would be trading our 4th and most of the rest of our picks to move back up into the 3rd round.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Obviously this draft will be evaluated fully only in two or three years. But that one will be in hindsight – it’ll mostly show which teams have analyzed the talents correctly, or merely “lucked out” in picking a player that ends up developing more than expected. At this point, however, we can still deliberate whether the strategy was correct or not (not the analysis of the players, but the strategy for the picks given our board). When doing that, it looks to me that we haven’t traded up enough, and we didn’t count in the “perceived value” of players.
I do realize that if the precise draft sequence were given to our war room, they’d know exactly where are the sweet spots for trading up, like I just did. It would be unjust to criticize them for that. I’m just saying, in the past two drafts, as far as I recall, we didn’t move up even once, contrary to most teams. In fact, we didn’t move down that much either, we just stayed put for most of it. Now, trades being one of the tools in the hands of the teams, why are we not using it?
And yes, by “moving up” I mean trade up within the same round (3rd and 4th mostly) at the price of a later round pick, of which we had plenty. Even for ST stars, why not get 2 excellent ST players, instead of 4 good ones, out of which 2 are going to be cut anyway?
Clearly, the good folks at the FO have been at it for far longer than me, and they actually get paid for what they do, so there’s a good reason to believe there are answers to these questions. I’m just wondering what are they.
There's an entitlement for first-third round picks, basically guaranteeing them to make the roster
And we didn’t have many open spots to begin with on our roster, as I showed here: http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2010/4/24/1441067/guessing-the-53-man-roster mid-draft,
and here: http://www.behindthesteelcurtain.com/2010/4/24/1442300/guessing-the-53-man-roster-post post-draft.
You may push that that’s all the more reason that we should’ve traded up – fill a few spots with “higher rated” talent – but take into account that guys with first to third round draft status are basically guaranteed to make the roster and stay on it for a couple of years before getting cut, even though they might not show much development at all during the time (case in point: Bruce Davis). Then if you trade up for a guy, that’s amplified all the more because you made that extra effort and investment just to get him in the first place. It’s not easy to cut and move on from high picks that don’t pan out.
by barnerburner on Apr 25, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions
With regard to LB, I expect Farrior, Foote, Timmons, and Fox to be your top 4 ILBs and Worilds to be OLB backup. But Gibson, Sylvester have nice potential, maybe sooner than expected. Between either or both of them and Frazier or Bailey stepping it up the team could almost be enticed to keep 9 LBs. Maybe Frazier makes it over Gibson largely due to experience, Sylvester makes it as ST and pass coverage specialist, Gibson to PS, and loser of Frazier vs Bailey gets cut.
LB's
OLB Woodley, Gibson
ILB Foote, Fox
ILB Timmons, Farrior
OLB Harrison, Worilds
Frazier, Bailey and Sylvester are battling for one 1 ST LB spot. Gibson and Worilds ST play determines if they can dress on Sundays. Possible Farrior doesn’t get a hat if the rooks can play ST and everyone healthy.
by steelerwheeler on Apr 27, 2010 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
why not get 2 excellent ST players, instead of 4 good ones, out of which 2 are going to be cut anyway
For one thing, our STs coverage sucked so bad last year, we may see more turnover in the depth positions than you think. That’s the biggest reason that I can think of. Add to that the entitlement that usually comes of being a top three round pick that barnerburner mentioned, and it makes sense to me that the FO chose not to trade right now.
It’s not as though the FO has never traded up or down in the past. But, they only do it for a player they’ve targeted that they really want and are fairly sure won’t drop to them. My guess would be that there were no such players in the last three drafts (except Sepulveda, apparently, which trading up for a punter shocked me, but…..).
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 8:32 PM EDT up reply actions
My best guess, srulix, is it’s a philosophy of we need that fire. You’re 14-17 months out from a championship run. Last year, injuries or no injuries, there was a lack of hunger, possibly most visible on special teams coverage units. Now people’s jobs are on the line, including veterans. If they don’t want it, or they can’t get it done anymore, go somewhere else. You can make this squad by being relentless special teamer and showing a potential for significant further development. WR is probably the tightest: Ward, Wallace, Randle-El are in… 3rd-rounder very very likely… Sweed, 6th-rounder, Battle: battle! Let’s say 1st-rounder is in behind Harrison & Woodley. Frazier, 4th-rounder, Bailey, A.Harrison if not on a team again: battle! Timmons, Fox (maybe our best special teams tackler last 2 years) are in. Farrior and Foote are older, not as fast as, and more expensive than 5th-rounder: battle! You might see OL reduced to 9 and LBs increased to 9, depending on who earns it. If a rookie WRs/returners are significantly better than Logan on kick coverage, almost as good on returns, and show much more potential to contribute to offense in future, Logan prob won’t make it onto this team.
By re-signing McFadden and Foote, we got players that know the system and are glad to be back in the Black and Gold. In the post draft press conferences, the coaches stressed ST, speed, and depth quite a bit. ARE and Arnaz Battle were signed FA’s to go with HInes and Wallace, plus we have Sweed along to try and get a spot. Anyone think that Golden Tate was going to want to play ST?
Good point
The supposed knock on Tate has been that he’s arrogant. It seems that the Steelers targeted guys that are just the opposite. And, if Tate doesn’t want to play STs, he probably won’t have a spot on our roster this year.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions
You got a steal in Dwyer in the 6th
Why he slid is debatable but don’t let the triple option both you. He ran out of Chan Gailey’s Pro Set as a freshman and did just fine. He had to adjust to the triple option his last 2 seasons. He had a great blend of size and speed and will be competing for your starter spot this season
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This is why you draft RBs late
Because there is insane value at RB all the way into the UFA pool.
Nothing against Rashard Mendenhall. He’s clearly a great player. But, if I were a front office guy you couldn’t get me to spend a first on a RB unless he were Jim Brown or Barry Sanders.
Why spend the pick when there’s always a Terrell Davis type hiding in the fifth round? Or a Willie Parker going undrafted.
That doesn’t always happen. Those are two examples in the last 15 years, but can you point to a 6th or 7th round RB in every draft that has been a star? It’s true that RBs are easier find later, but Terrell Davis or FWP type is going a bit far, I think.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 25, 2010 8:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I said fifth round . . . you moved my argument
The simple fact is there is so much value down draft, that I consider almost any 1st used on a RB to be scary.
What particularly worries me with 1st round RBs is how hard they’ve been run in college. You get way too many Ki-jana Carters — guys who wasted a lot of cartilage playing unpaid ball — to risk a 1st round pick on a RB, unless you feel strongly he can be a Jim Brown or a Barry Sanders.
It’s an extremely high-risk approach at a position where the career lifespan for superstars tends way too close to the NFL average of 4.5 years. NFL RB is an ugly business.
by theobserver on Apr 25, 2010 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions
5th Round
Sorry, didn’t mean to move your argument. :) You confused me by using Davis and FWP (7th round, IIRC, and UDFA) as your examples. Still can you point to a 5th rounder every year in the past 15 years that has turned out as productive as those two?
Agreed on the beating many top picks have taken in college. Mendenhall isn’t really a good example there either though, since he only started one year in college. I did think that about Adrian Peterson, but he’s proved to be a great player.
For ideas on statistical analyses, email me at wolfpacksteelersfan@gmail.com.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Apr 26, 2010 8:12 AM EDT up reply actions
Bryan Bulaga
Why didn’t they go Bryan Bulaga in the first round. I hope it was because they wanted a center and not because Pouncey worked out with Taylor in the off season.
Check one of the earlier posts about Pouncey or the first day
Pouncey is an unusual talent – very athletic, 6’4 300 pounds without much fat on him, very smart. He has position flexibility as well, since he’s going to step in and play guard now before sliding over to be center for the next 10 years.
Bulaga isn’t very athletic, struggles to deal with speed rushers, and some say he has short arms – all that adds up to him likely being a right tackle in this league instead of a premium left tackle. We may not have Pro Bowl talent at either tackle spot right now, but Starks and Colon are pretty well entrenched at those spots for the short term – Starks because he’s got that rich contract and Colon because he just might’ve been our best lineman last year.
In terms of overall talent and potential, most boards had Pouncey rated over Bulaga, despite most mock drafts saying that being a tackle as opposed to a center, Bulaga should’ve gone first.
by barnerburner on Apr 25, 2010 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I also like
the other lineman who was drafted. As a fifth round selection, I don’t think you’ll often find as much value as Chris Scott offers. I think by the end of training camp that he will be solidly entrenched as the primary backup to Colon and Starks. It doesn’t seem at all evident that he is bound for the practice squad….
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TE's ?????
How we supposed to run the d@#$ ball with Miller, Spaeth, McHugh and Johnson? None of those guys are good blocking TE’s.
Shut your mouth.
Miller is one of the best blocking TE’s in the league.
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