Dazed and Confused Over Hazing in Latrobe
by Neal Coolong on Jul 27, 2010 7:11 AM EDT
23 comments
One of my favorite summer traditions is watching Richard Linklatter's classic "Dazed and Confused." Twins games, grilling and watching "Dazed and Confused." You can set your watch to me watching this movie each June, reviving a college tradition where Jash, Troll and I would watch it basically every night in late May, until we departed for the summer.
I got behind the 8-ball on my tradition this year, having popped it in the ol' Blue Ray in mid-July. It made it almost better, in a way. One of the coolest opening sequences ever produced, the slow-motion filing of stoned high school kids into the last day of school to Aerosmith's "Sweet Emotion," seemed even more timeless.
Maybe that's what got me to see it in a different light, but I found it even more enjoyable in 2010. My wife and I laughed hugely around the idea of what would happen if kids tried to do even one aspect of what Randall "Pink" Floyd, Donny, Bennie and Slater did that night.
At its root, the ritual hazing of the freshman-to-be, up to and including forcing them to bend over and accept paddling by the newly minted senior class.
I'm sure that's not what Cowboys veteran WR Roy Williams was thinking when he asked rookie Dez Bryant to carry his shoulder pads as Dallas kicked off training camp.
Or was it?
Williams grew up in Odessa, Tex., attending Permian High School, the rival of the subject school of Dazed and Confused, Midland Lee. Bryant's a Texan, too, hailing from Lufkin.
The incident allegedly played out when Williams told Bryant to carry his shoulder pads, and Bryant refused. It's sort of akin to O'Banion chasing Carl and Mitch down through their neighborhood, paddle in hand (FAH-Q) ready to dish out punishment for making it to the 9th grade. Carl and Mitch obtain refuge in Carl's house, while Carl's mom (Jerry Jones?) cocks a shotgun in O'Banion's face.
"Oh, and Mitch, Carl...we'll be seeing each other again soon."
Not to pick on Texans, but the Steelers have a few of their own. Casey Hampton, Tony Hills and Jonathon Scott all went to Texas, but former Steelers P Josh Miller told Christine Newby (perfect last name for this column) on 93.7 The Fan's web site that hazing is a part of the game.
"You got a guy that says, ‘No.' What does that mean? ‘OK, let's really get him.' So I mean, (Bryant) is setting himself up before the first snap has even started in training camp so hopefully he'll turn around and just accept anything that's coming to him and then they will get off of him," Miller said to the radio station.
These kinds of stories aren't reported around the Steelers very often. The most notable of late was what the veterans did to Rashard Mendenhall after fumbling twice at Minnesota in the preseason of 2008.
Steelers players got $100 for stealing a football that Mendenhall was required to carry with him at all times. They got $500 if they were able to return it to the running backs meeting. Mendenhall was responsible for paying the player who took it from him.
Hines Ward and Willie Parker were behind the scheme, which may or may not have helped; Mendenhall fumbled three times last season. But coach Mike Tomlin's words about the inter-team discipline is very fitting: "Peer pressure is the ultimate motivator."
While Williams tries to deflect the shine from the O'Banion spotlight he's been placed under, and people everywhere debate whether Bryant's Mitch-and-Carl act is good or bad, it seems as if the Steelers locker room acts much like what the self-described ineffectual nothing Mike says when the senior girls are telling the freshmen to "fry like bacon," or to "air raid."
"What amazes me about this is that everyone seems to be condoning this, or at least turning their heads. I mean, they gave them permission to use the parking lot, they're selling refreshments."
Then again, telling players to not fumble the ball isn't the same as telling them to carry their shoulder pads. Williams' motivation comes into question. Maybe he didn't want to drop them, like he dropped most of what was thrown at him last year.
The Steelers are a veteran-laden team, well-known around the league as being very open to helping rookies contribute to the team. Maybe they have to carry shoulder pads here and there, which seems a trifle lame, but if Hampton or Ward tells a rookie to do something, we gotta think he'll do it.
Or, at the least, we're not going to read much about it. Like Tomlin says, peer pressure is the ultimate motivator. Or, as Miller said, if you refuse, then they're really going to get you.
I'm looking forward to seeing Bryant being driven through a car wash.
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Classic Movie
I still love Matthew McConaughey’s quote….
“That’s what I love about these High School girls man. I get older, they stay the same age. Yes they do. Yes they do.”
Bryant is making this way way harder than this has to be. Just carry his pads Dez…….or not……seeing the Cowboys implode from within has also been a rite of passage the past 10 yrs or so just like watching Dazed and Confused.
ALL rookies have had to undergo some form of hazing. And for the most part, the NFL hazing is harmless without malice or intent to harm. Every NFL star has had to undergo this. Its intent is to build some camaraderie and instills humility into the 1st rounders reminding them that they haven’t done squat on an NFL playing field.
So just carry his pad Dez…..they’ll forget about it soon enough when you have taken his starting position.
"…seeing the Cowboys implode from within has also been a rite of passage the past 10 yrs or so just like watching Dazed and Confused."
Couldn’t have been said better…not sure how I didn’t come up with that earlier!
by Neal Coolong on Jul 27, 2010 8:45 AM EDT up reply actions
The Steelers are more like a college fraternity.....
….and Ward and Farrior are sort of like the pledgemasters.
There is a history the pledges learn, and tradition. The alumni are always around. There’s a lot of peer pressure here.
Rookies don’t join the Steelers. They pledge the House of Steel. They wear the Black and Gold with pride and have brothers all over the world.
No one is bigger than the House of Steel. Not their one-time wide top wide receiver. Not even their big stupid quarterback. The undergraduate leadership (locker room peers) and the national (coaches and front office) work well together to maintain order and unity.
You won’t see a Dez Bryant incident at Latrobe. Our pledge classes don’t work that way.
I would kill everyone in this room for a drop of sweet beer.
- Homer J. Simpson
Very interesting outlook
Homer J… very interesting outlook. Were you a member of a Fraternity? As a Fraternity Alum I understand what you mean… my chapter did not engage in any hazing.
I was also in a fraternity that was very against hazing. When I was a pledge, a brother yelled “shut up pledge” one night in a room full of people. I tossed his ass over the pong table by his shirt (he was 6" taller and 50 lbs heavier than me too) and chugged a beer in his face. I was on the exec board the next semester and in charge of pledge classes from then on. I think it’s stupid.
Yes I was in a college fraternity, and there was some hazing...
…stuff like a pledge trip where he had to find and bring back certain stuff….
….there was the kidnapping, where we were gathered up and dumped off at a certain place and had to find our way back to campus……
….and some pretty lopsided pledge versus brother athletic contests…
This that was designed to foster unity and a sense of belonging, but absolutely NO physical abuse or forcing people to drink too much or any of that stuff. This was back in the late 60’s, and our alumni advisor was a highly respected lawyer who put the fear of God in us with stories of abuse in other fraternity chapters that led to serious injuries and deaths. Plus, back then, there was a strong anti-authoritarian streak on our campus. The only way the Greek system survived was by ending or cutting back on hazing.
I’m still occasionally in touch with some of my brothers – from coast to coast – and am proud of how so much of them have led happy and useful lives and met with great personal success.
I would kill everyone in this room for a drop of sweet beer.
- Homer J. Simpson
“Rookies don’t join the Steelers. They pledge the House of Steel. They wear the Black and Gold with pride and have brothers all over the world.”
Great Quote, and Great Screen Name!
When You Look Upon Us
And You See This BLACK & GOLD
You Shall Fear Us
For We Will Best You,
As We Are The PITTSBURGH STEELERS
And We Are Legendary
Book of Chachi
4:12
I have a feeling that Dez Bryant might have behaved differently in Latrobe
Roy Williams’ quotes about the things “this locker room is capable of” (not word for word) when it comes to rookies kinda made me wonder. Of course hazing of rookies is pretty much normal in football, and MT might have a point with peer pressure improving the rooks. But it should also always be kept in perspective of keeping your locker room a tight group and not dividing them. Maybe the Cowboys haven’t been able to do that so well, and who could blame them with the Divas, Jerry Jones, and the media attention they have and had.
Back to my point though. Am I the only one getting the feeling that had someone like Hines Ward asked him to carry his pads after OTAs and some WR meetings had already been concluded (including a ton of help Bryant would have gotten from Ward and other veterans), Byant would not have had a problem carrying another guy’s shoulder pads? If I am a rookie getting to a new team, I sure as heck won’t do stuff for people that have been treating me like I am out to steal their spot. If they’ve helped to make my transition to the NFL as easy as possible though (for the good of the team, who can always use new talent), I wouldn’t have a problem symbolically or literally carrying their pads.
Maybe I am giving Ward specifically and the Steelers locker room in general way too much credit, and feel free correct me if I do. But it seems like the veterans here have in the recent past taken pride in helping the rookies, which is why such hazing by players like Ward or Reed (remember the frog?) seems more accepted and more of a non-issue.
Agreed
I think it’s a bit of an issue of respect. You can tolerate being put through hazing’s if you respect the people who are doing it and know it’s all in good fun. If you feel like you’re being targeted because the player is worried about you stealing his position from him? Yeah, you might refuse because you feel like your pride is on the line.
by Chicago Steeler on Jul 27, 2010 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions
The Force is strong with this one...
As opposing quarterbacks crouched under center, Lambert pumped his legs up and down, thumping the turf like a war drum. He mouthed threats to opposing running backs that would make even the most hardened Catholic nun weep for humanity. He fulfilled those threats with coldblooded suplex tackles. He may or may not have chain-smoked at halftime, depending on who you ask.
For sixty minutes each Sunday, Jack Lambert was a demon.
Out of Hand?
I haven’t ever heard of things getting out of hand at the Steelers training camps…I mean, there’s the rookie talent show…but I know that hazing can get ugly elsewhere. I remember a few years back, it might have been during the Ditka era, there was a really terrible incident at the Saints training camp where then rookie Cam Cleeland was almost blinded. Cleeland went on to recover and have a serviceable NFL career (latched on with the Pats, as I recall, and might have a ring to his credit because of it), but I know the ‘Aints were really high on him at the time and he never lived up to his potential. Here’s a link to the NY Times article I dug up if you want to read further:
http://www.nytimes.com/1998/08/28/sports/pro-football-former-saints-rookie-describes-hazing.html
As for the Cowboys, I think it’s odd that Roy Williams somehow feels he is the leader of that wideout crew. His claim to fame in Dallas, thus far, has been to make TO expendable by coming in and short-arming even more balls than TO did at twice the price.
This case isn't really hazing
All Williams did was ask the guy to carry his pads, which is an age-old tradition with veteran players. It is a “rite of passage” for rookies.
However I kind of understand why Dez may have refused to carry Roy’s pads; he doesn’t want to carry the pads of the man he was drafted to replace. Quite honestly Dez might already be a better receiver than Roy is currently, so I see why he would have a problem with it. Roy hasn’t even come close to living up to the standards that Jerry Jones set for him when they acquired him from Detroit.
Now if Miles Austin or Tony Romo were to ask Dez for smething similiar, like carry their pads or get them some breakfast, then they got a big problem. That would be like Worilds or Gibson refusing to carry the pads of Harrison and Woodley, which is a blatent sign of disrespect and arrogance.
"Don't Call It A Comeback"
by StoneColdSteel on Jul 27, 2010 11:58 AM EDT reply actions
I love what Dez Bryant did. They are all paid professional players. Carry your own pads, and get your own breakfast.
I think StoneColdSteel is on to something—there is more going on than simple hazing. Surely Williams can see the writing on the wall; his career has been largely disappointing and he’s done little to justify the considerable price that Dallas paid to bring him in (a 1st, a 3rd, and a 6th). Dez Bryant, by all accounts, looks hungry and poised to vindicate himself after dropping in the draft. Bryant isn’t there to apprentice under Williams (what would Williams teach him? ), he’s there to take his job and all of the money and prestige that goes with it.
I see a huge difference between "hazing," what the Steelers did in the Mendenhall situation, and what Williams did with Bryant.
For one, the Mendenhall situation was, as Coolong described it, " inter-team discipline." There was a problem with a teammate. They stepped in to correct it so coaches didn’t have to. Think back to when you were a kid: did you like doing what your parents asked you? Generally no. But when the cool babysitter or favorite cousin asks you to do the very same thing? You’re on it with a smile.
Hazing. Seems to me that this is more done not to drive anybody away, or make a statement, as much as it is a rite of passage and a tradition.
What Williams did was foolish. It’s his own fault he had his Gatorade thrown back in his face. He pickedon absolutely the wrong guy! You do not pick on a guy who is a) trying to take your position b) someone you bitched about when the team drafted him c) is wildly popular with the fans, when you are not and d) actually succeeds at catches passes, something that is just a little vital when playing a position where “receiver” is in it’s title.
He could have picked on any number of rooks, but he chose the wrong one. And didn’t he think that MAYBE, just MAYBE Bryant still has a little good ol’ fashioned Texas-sized contempt for a Texas high school rival? High school football competition is intense in that state. Animosity is tangible. Bryant is barely out of high school. His memory is fresh.
I think Bryant did the right thing. And my guess is he would carry another teammates pads. Just not Williams.
If I were Bryant, I’d even tack on a condition: Roy, you learn to catch a pass every now and then, NEXT YEAR I will carry your pads for the first week of training camp.
A rookie rewarding a veteran for a doing a job properly that the veteran should be doing already.
I'll be hiking the Pacific Crest Trail from May, 2011 to Sept., 2011, to raise money for charity. Please visit: http://thf2.wordpress.com for more info. Thanks!
Kind of Reminds me of Troy Edwards...
The first thing I thought of when I read this was “Troy Edwards.” Of course there were no reported stories of Edwards refusal to carry on a shoulder pads carrying tradition or anything like that, but before arriving at camp he did make some derogatory comments about the Steelers wideouts who were in front of him — not that Courtney Hawkins or Will Blackwell should have commanded awe inspiring respect. (Edwards also boasted about his failure to work out, explaining that “I can’t race air….”)
But that is not the point, this is a horrendous way to start things off.
by Hombre de Acero on Jul 27, 2010 7:51 PM EDT reply actions
Credit card comment
William said he would have go to “step 2” – which he has seen people steal player’s credit cards, their wives credit cards and max them out. This, frankly, struck me as demonstrating the ridiculous extravagance that NFL players indulge.
As a regular fan of the NFL, and in the day of the internet, one of my everyday fears is that someone will steal and max out my credit card. If Williams’ description of what NFL athletes do for fun (max out each others credit cards, maybe their wives) it makes me wonder if perhaps we should cut ticket prices in half and still allow players to just max out other player’s credit cards (but leave their wives out of it).
Obviously, this tongue-in-cheek comment oversimplifies the relationship between ticket prices and player’s salaries. However, every time I look at a jersey with $100 price tag or a ticket with $120.00, his comment will stick with me.
If I were going to advocate against an uncapped year or try to get players accept lower salaries, this is a devastating clip. Here is what I’d say:
“NFL fans are about to watch players walk out on them because, even though they make so much money they can max out their teammates credit cards for fun, that’s still not enough for them.”
Major League Baseball players got destroyed in the court of public opinion when they struck (out?) over their demand for more money. With the perception that players can go around and drop $20,000 or $40,000 for fun – its only going to be worse for the NFL.
The problem is someone is going to make that money. Whether it’s the players making obscene amounts or the owners. The money is out there to be had, and it’s capitalism, so it’s not like the government is going to force ticket prices down or anything. So the money exists it’s just who gets more of it, players or owners?
by Chicago Steeler on Jul 28, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Also
The owners opted out of the CBA, not the players. The players are fine with the way things are now per the NFLPA, its the owners who want more money.
Steelers football is 60 mins.
by tannofsteel84 on Jul 28, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
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