Steelers Perspective 2010
by Joey M on Feb 11, 2011 1:05 AM EST
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Hi All
This is my first post, but after reading BTSC for a couple years now, I finally feel like I have something that won't be a repeat of whats already been said. My Mom is from East McKeesport so I've been a lifelong Steeler fan. The last few years watching the Steelers has left me with one strong overall feeling. We've been damn lucky. It started before SB XL and continued until last Sunday just before game time. Allow me to elaborate. The following list comprises what I believe to be constitutes the "luck" i speak of.
1) we were the sixth seed in the AFC
2) Carson Palmer goes out with the bum knee
3) Ben Tackles Harper on fumble return
4) Vandejact misses field goal
5) Seahawks kill themselves with penalties
6) the entire SB 43 season we won games we probaly shoudn't have
7) Romo throws boneheaded pick six to give us that game
8) We beat San Diego 11-10
9) Harrison's pick six off Warner before halftime
10) 88 yard drive with time winding down and Holmes somehow gets 2 feet down
11) we go 3-1 without Ben
12) we convert 3rd & 19 against Baltimore D
13) Houshmanzadeh drops 1st down reception to seal game
14) Sanchez sack / fumble
15) Ben passes for 1st down to seal game
16) Troy, Troy, & more Troy
All these things could have changed the outcome of our season or a game, but somehow they all went our way. I went into this SB thinking that our time for luck was up. To think we still could have won that game still amazes me, and believe me..... I thought Ben was gonna do it again. I prefer to think of this loss as "luck"
not being on our side. How lucky were we to get see the cowboys implode before our eyes this season. That alone was worth everything to me. Almost as good as a SB win......almost. I used to read the "McMillen & wife Steeler site alot, and I got so sick of hearing how Arians was killing us, as we keep having winning seasons and went to 3 Super Bowls. 3/4's of the way through the 08 season I finally posted something to the affect of........ what are you guys gonna say about Arians if we make the SB? We Did. and we made again and I still hear the same refrain.
My point is....... the Steelers have been winning ugly for the last 6 years, and yet we won 2 super bowls and went to 3. It couldn't last forever. One last thing. I officially predict the next SB to be a repeat of the 2 teams we just saw, but with the oppisite outcome.
thx,
Joey
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Thanks for posting.
You point to lucky, but very few teams who have huge success do it without those times where if something had just gone the other way a little bit they wouldn’t have near the success.
After all, look at the Patriots and the tuck rule.
" Just go and lay your hand on a Pittsburgh Steeler fan, and then I think you'll finally understand"
" In America" Charlie Daniels Band
Interesting - But not entirely luck
Sure things happened. But you have to capitalize on the mistakes of others, or you have to do enough to overcome what mistakes you made.
Luck to me is more how a ball would bounce, something I really cannot control. If there’s something I have any control over, I do not define that as luck per se. So some of your list is pure luck. 4,5,7,13
Others are things we were able to overcome or make happen. # 9 and 11 come to mind.
The rest is open to interpretation. Therefore, # 3,8,12,15,16 I do not classify as luck, but others might.
- to me is a mix of luck and effort
One of the great disappointments of a football game is that the cheerleaders never seem to get injured.
A lot of this has to do with parity in the league.
I agree that the Steelers have been quite fortunate and have won a lot of games that weren’t exactly pretty. Despite their shortcomings, though, they’re normally perennial contenders. I don’t like the direction that the league has gone in terms of trying to make all of the teams roughly equal. I liked it better when there were 4 or 5 dominant teams that would slug it out each year for the championship. As evidence of the generally crappy brand of play in the NFL today, consider that, even though the Steelers played on of their worst games of the year in the SB, they still had a good chance to win late in the 4th quarter. Today it seems that nobody is very good at pressing their advantage and closing out a game. Don’t know exactly why that is.
The only thing is,
if you get your wish and revenue sharing and salary caps go away, the Steelers won’t be one of those 4 or 5 dominant teams, because they don’t have a big enough market and deep enough pockets to sustain a spend-a-thon. And free agency is never, ever going to go away, and basically, being able to sign somebody and have them for as long as you want them at a reasonable rate is the key to building a ‘dynastic’ team like the Steelers of the 70s. So you would be forced to root for the Cowboys or the Redskins or the Raiders if you wanted to pull for one of the dominant teams. That would suck : )
"If you're not getting better, I don't care what business you're in, you're a dead man. I try to look critically at the mistakes that I make and try to learn from them, like our team does." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Feb 11, 2011 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
This is why I wanted the Steelers to win this SB.
I’ve been a fan since 1968 and this is the one I wanted the most, just in case it’s the last real SB ever. I could walk away from the NFL (probably not really, but not get Sunday ticket for sure) if the go the way of MLB or the NBA.
If you buy a foreign made product you give money to a person who will not be buying an American made product that you get paid to make. Think about it next time you're at the store.
All the contracts are guarteed though so they get lots for doing a little and I don't want to see that.
If you buy a foreign made product you give money to a person who will not be buying an American made product that you get paid to make. Think about it next time you're at the store.
I agree there's no turning back.
But I think the overall level of play in the NFL is getting worse and worse each year. This doesn’t seem to bother anyone these days except old timers like me who can still remember what the game used to be.
I don't think it was luck
I don’t agree with you about the luck.
The Steelers in 2005 played to win, in the Colts game if I remeber well the refs denied a clear interception to Polamalu and with that the Colts hadn’t made a comeback, Ben tackled Harper because he followed the play until the end, what about Denver’s game? The Steelers played a terrific game in special Ben, in the SB the Ike’s interception wasn’t luck, so in 2008 I agree with you in the way our team played all the season but please recall the championships are won by good defenses and in that year the best defense belonged to us
The lost on Sunday came because the mistakes made and we didn’t be capable to create one to capture any momentun in the game
In my opinion it wasn’t a matter of luck, we had the team to get a new victory but Packers took advantage of our errors to win the game
For my perception the luck comes when you look for it
In a win, in a lose or in a Tie a Steeler fan forever and until I die.
Looking for the seven soon
The Glory and the luck come when you look for it.
God is the trainer
I dispute Point 8
When we beat San Diego 11-10, Troy had a TD called back by an official. The league office later indicated that the call was an error, and the TD should have been allowed. So I do not see that game as an example of our “good fortune”…
Gerela's Gorillas are here for the show
and so is Franco's Army
It's been many years in coming
just watch that Steeler machinery humming!
by GoldMetalDefense on Feb 11, 2011 8:19 PM EST reply actions
And as to Point 10
Ben and Santonio essentially did the same thing in the second Ravens game that year, when BB took us the length of the field to reverse the outcome only ’Tone caught it in the just over the goal line instead of at the back corner of the end zone.
I submit that if you can replicate the feat then it’s not luck…
Gerela's Gorillas are here for the show
and so is Franco's Army
It's been many years in coming
just watch that Steeler machinery humming!
by GoldMetalDefense on Feb 11, 2011 8:23 PM EST reply actions
wrong word
As I see now…….. “luck” is not the word. my main point is that all those games made me sick to my stomach. I live and die with this team and until the games were over, I never felt comfortable. One example would be the Jets playoff game. We had a 24-3 lead and buddy texted me “how many more you want before you feel comfortable”. I text back “14”. He texts “no shiite”. Did we have to sweat that game to the end? You bet we did. Its what we do….lol. Good comment on the parity and closing out games. I just hate freaking out 19 games in row, or letting teams we should kill play us close, or relying on “Immaculate Receptions & Tackles”, or Troy doing something unearthly.
One more example of things I hate:
the Texans game we lost while outgaining them 300 yards to 36yards. Tournovers did us in that game. I think there was an Oakland game we did too.
Anyways, thanks for the replys and letting me vent
Joey
Welcome, Joey -
lots of venting happens around here, as you have probably noticed, so enjoy!
"If you're not getting better, I don't care what business you're in, you're a dead man. I try to look critically at the mistakes that I make and try to learn from them, like our team does." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Feb 11, 2011 10:52 PM EST up reply actions
Vent anytime
We all do at some point. I know that Tomlin says style points don’t matter and he’s right. however, I would really love to see us really command a game. I know we can, but most of our wins are ugly and our losses can be even uglier.
One of the great disappointments of a football game is that the cheerleaders never seem to get injured.
i doubt steelers and packers get back in next year
this happened once in SB history, dallas and bills and only two teams came back from a SB loss to win it the next year.
there is a lot of what appears to be luck in the NFL but i think it is the parity being disguised as luck.
whoever said that revenue sharing is good for teams like pgh, they are absolutely right. dallas and wash make 6-8 X the operating profit that the steelers and vikes make. in 2009 dallas made $143mm operating profit while steelers made $18mm.
dallas and washington could easily outspend us by $50-70mm and it would turn into a pirates and yankees type situation.
that being said, jerry jones hates revenue sharing (as would any owner able to generate this kind of $, this is what capitalism is all about) and this is behind the new CBA. the owners like snyder and jones want the players to take a cut in pay so that the revenue sharing does not come out of their end.
in my opinion, the players are going to have to take their pants down or we will not have football for the foreseeable future. the NFL has a lot of sales/revenue ($9 billion but net profits are pretty dismal and concentrated amongs to 8 teams). players are paid way too much 60% of the revenue pie is too much to pay employees, no business can thrive with this much going to employees. the league needs to develop a model similar to investment banks, they pay many employees $10, 20 or $30mm a year but it is not salary, it is bonus based on their profitablility and usually the total employee compensation is about 40% of revenue.
steelers are the perfect example, how are you going to pay nmandi even $7-8mm (assuming he would even go that low) when your net profit is probably about $5mm? yea, we consistently make about $10-20 million operating profit but that is before int, depr and taxes.
i don’t want jones and snyder becoming the new steinbrenners but eventually greed will win out. especially as you get more billionaires who can afford to invest for the long term.
60% of the revenue pie is too much to pay employees
To be fair to the players, what they get is not 60% of the total $9 billion in revenue, what they get is 60% of revenue after the owners take $1 billion off the top, which comes to 53% of the total revenue. That may still be more than the business model can sustain in the long run (which is what the owners are claiming). Your idea of the investment bank-type bonuses has merit, but since the only franchise that will open their books to the players is Green Bay (and they only do it because they have to as a publicly owned franchise) then you can see why the players might not trust that these bonuses would actually ever materialize.
"If you're not getting better, I don't care what business you're in, you're a dead man. I try to look critically at the mistakes that I make and try to learn from them, like our team does." - Mike Tomlin
by Rebecca Rollett on Feb 12, 2011 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
well the books of the Packers shows that this model is working
their profit in 2006 was something like $26 million and last year it was $9 million. Even though their gross revenue grew, so did expenses. Even with an 18 game schedule, it won’t help that much.
Players who should be in the Hall of Fame: Pat TIllman, Dwight White, Donnie Shell, L.C. Greenwood, Ray Guy, Steve Tasker, Jack Butler, Greg Llyod, Andy Russel, Cris Carter, Kevin Greene, Curtis Martin, Willie Roaf, Andre Reed and Jerry Kramer
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." Martin Luther King Jr.
Canal Street Chronicles resident Steelers Fan
by WVPiratesfan on Feb 12, 2011 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
momma is right it is not 60% of gross
i should have been clearer but even at 53% it is still way too high for the future capital investments needed. like it or not, to keep the owners interested in making the huge investments needed (like cowboys stadium) players need to make somewhere in the neighborhood of 45% of gross revenue (i think the owners put about 46.7% on the table), however you get there. jerry jones is right on with that 180 ft television screen, he needs these types of bells and whistles to get people to show up. the home viewing experience is just too good now, fans want the wow factor when paying thru the nose for tickets. there is just too much competition for entertainment dollars.
and you are right the players would never accept the bonus model, it is way too complicated for the NFL and potential stars would all want to play for the cowboys who could hand out $25mm in bonuses for a SB win. but this would actually make the NFL players very accountable, Jamarcus Russells would not “steal” from their teams, this kind of wasted $ would go to veterans have proven they deserve it.
the packers made $9.6mm operating profit most recently (not net profit). this means they are very marginally profitable (remember, they have to pay 34% of the $9.6mm in federal taxes) and this doesn’t include depreciation or interest. luckily for the pack they have almost no debt. but either way, if this was a co. interested in making money management would have been fired long ago. small market teams absolutely need salary relief or they will eventually be stuck with crappy stadiums and facilities while the cowboys and redskins enjoy their state of the art amenities.
steelers and packers are losers when it comes to making $ and the ownership is not as concerned with this. compare the $9.6mm oprerating profit (pack) or $18mm (steelers) with the $144mm of the cowboys or the $100mm of the redskins and you realize that it is not a good business for many of the owners. yea, they are getting by but when something like a new stadium comes up (and they don’t want to or can’t use public $) how do you pull it off? the status quo works now but eventually owners want cash-flow so that they can expand their team revenues. billionaires, by definition, did not get to be that rich by accepting the status quo, they are always reaching for bigger & better.
i doubt steelers and packers get back in next year
this happened once in SB history, dallas and bills and only two teams came back from a SB loss to win it the next year.
there is a lot of what appears to be luck in the NFL but i think it is the parity being disguised as luck.
whoever said that revenue sharing is good for teams like pgh, they are absolutely right. dallas and wash make 6-8 X the operating profit that the steelers and vikes make. in 2009 dallas made $143mm operating profit while steelers made $18mm.
dallas and washington could easily outspend us by $50-70mm and it would turn into a pirates and yankees type situation.
that being said, jerry jones hates revenue sharing (as would any owner able to generate this kind of $, this is what capitalism is all about) and this is behind the new CBA. the owners like snyder and jones want the players to take a cut in pay so that the revenue sharing does not come out of their end.
in my opinion, the players are going to have to take their pants down or we will not have football for the foreseeable future. the NFL has a lot of sales/revenue ($9 billion but net profits are pretty dismal and concentrated amongs to 8 teams). players are paid way too much 60% of the revenue pie is too much to pay employees, no business can thrive with this much going to employees. the league needs to develop a model similar to investment banks, they pay many employees $10, 20 or $30mm a year but it is not salary, it is bonus based on their profitablility and usually the total employee compensation is about 40% of revenue.
steelers are the perfect example, how are you going to pay nmandi even $7-8mm (assuming he would even go that low) when your net profit is probably about $5mm? yea, we consistently make about $10-20 million operating profit but that is before int, depr and taxes.
i don’t want jones and snyder becoming the new steinbrenners but eventually greed will win out. especially as you get more billionaires who can afford to invest for the long term.
Cookies crumble.
I reckon you could do that for most teams the last few years. There is so much parity that 1 or 2 plays decides lots of games.
same old same old
I mean this in a different context compared to when Art Sr. muttered those famous words noone ever let him forget:“…the gm has changed alot but it’s still the same old Stillers.”Get used to it Joey.Not sure how many years you’ve been bleeding black & gold.40+ for me.Trust me,it’s all luck.Just a matter of crossin T’s and dottin I’s & hope our # comes up in the lottery every yr.We can be like CLV or some others who never enter the room let alone get their foot in the door.This is a hard loss to get over because it feels like the end of an era.An era GB started out on top and end’s on top.I comfort myself in the fact that from ‘73 -’92 they had 3 non-strike winning seasons & no playoff wins.
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