How Impressive was Flacco's AFCCG Performance?
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 27, 2012 10:33 PM EST
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PrintI know that this may be beating a dead horse, or maybe raising an issue that most Steelers fans don't really care about. But, I was interested in it, so I decided a to take a quick look at it. Ever since the Ravens lost the AFCCG to the Pats in heart-wrenching fashion due to the missed Billy Cundiff 32 yard FG, the main takeaway from the game for the media seems to be this: "You can't say anymore that Joe Flacco can't step up in the big games." Because he basically outplayed Tom Brady in that game right? While Brady passed for under 250 yards, 0 TDs, and 2 INTs, Flacco had over 300 yards, 2 TDs, and only 1 INT. However, was Flacco's performance against that Patriots' defense really that impressive?
A quick look at the passing totals achieved throughout the season against the Patriots this year seem to throw a wrench into the idea of Flacco's brilliance against the Pats. I just pulled the defensive passing yards allowed by the Pats in each game this past season from Pro-Football-Reference.com and sorted from highest to lowest.
| Defense | |||
| Rank | Week | Opp | PassY |
| 1 | 12 | Philadelphia Eagles | 393 |
| 2 | 1 | Miami Dolphins | 390 |
| 3 | 2 | San Diego Chargers | 372 |
| 4 | 3 | Buffalo Bills | 369 |
| 5 | 4 | Oakland Raiders | 344 |
| 6 | 13 | Indianapolis Colts | 338 |
| 7 | 8 | Pittsburgh Steelers | 329 |
| 8 | 6 | Dallas Cowboys | 300 |
| 9 | 17 | Buffalo Bills | 296 |
| 10 | 14 | Washington Redskins | 293 |
| 11 | ConfChamp | Baltimore Ravens | 282 |
| 12 | 10 | New York Jets | 268 |
| 13 | 16 | Miami Dolphins | 253 |
| 14 | 9 | New York Giants | 250 |
| 15 | 11 | Kansas City Chiefs | 209 |
| 16 | 5 | New York Jets | 158 |
| 17 | 15 | Denver Broncos | 141 |
| 18 | Division | Denver Broncos | 108 |
These passing totals are adjusted based on sacked yards lost, which is why the Ravens' number is less than 300 yards. This is not some in depth analysis, but it does show that Flacco's total yards passing in the CG was bested during the regular season by such great QBs as Vince Young (Phi), Chad Henne (Mia), Ryan Fitzpatrick (Buf), Jason Campbell (Oak), Dan Orlovsky (Ind), and Tony Romo (that great clutch player).
I certainly think that expectations will be raised for Flacco based on this performance. However, based on the overall performance of the Pats' defense this season, I don't know that his performance was really as impressive as it first seems. As with all things, time will tell. And maybe this will be the confidence boost that Flacco needs to get himself over the hump.
It's also interesting to note how low the Giants rank on that list, given the upcoming SB rematch.
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But Ray Rice said he's now a top 5 Qb
Even with there weak ass defense, Bellicheat and his Pats are in the Super Bowl. This being said and not to take away from a well played game on Flacco’s part, the line for being considered a top 5 Qb against there defense this year was as long as the Jersey Shore. Sorry Ray but in this fans eyes he’s got to prove a lot more to be in the top 5 than shredding a pass coverage made of swiss cheese.
by Ohio Steeler on Jan 27, 2012 11:29 PM EST via mobile reply actions
if he is a top 5 QB..
where is he? Rodgers, brees, Brady, E. Manning, BB, flacco? This is not in order…where does FLACCO crack the top 5?
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by nycsteelerfan on Jan 28, 2012 2:19 PM EST up reply actions
I'd put rivers ahead of flacco anyday
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 29, 2012 1:47 AM EST up reply actions
yes, definitely. I would put Brady, Manning, Rogers, Brees, Roethlisberger, Eli and Rivers all well above Flacco. Also maybe Schaub, Romo, Ryan and Newton. (I dont think much of flacco)
by Dr. Spaceman on Jan 29, 2012 9:37 PM EST up reply actions
In no real order my list would be:
Big Ben, Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Phillip Rivers, Cam Newton and Matthew Stafford….
Before Flacco, so he would be somewhere around 11th on my choice of QB.
Schaub could have well been above him if not for injury this season, so I still havent seen the real Schaub in playoff type situations.
Never a fan of Romo, I think he lacks control and command of his offense.
Matt Ryan, whether it is playcalling or himself, he lacks serious balls.
So yeah, at worst I would rank Flacco around about #12.
Formerly known as Steeler_
BTSC's token Kiwi fan. That means I'm a New Zealander. Yes, that small country next to Australia....no we are not part of Australia
by Michael Hewitt on Jan 29, 2012 9:57 PM EST up reply actions
Nice post
And although you didn’t go that in-depth with stats and whatnot, how deep do you need to dig??
He “out-played” Brady in this game, but consider the facts- NE- worst D in the league, Baltimore- 3rd ranked D in the league. Brady would throw for 400, maybe 500+ yards against his own defense every day of the week. But, considering the way Flacco played against Houston, maybe he is a Top 5 QB after facing New England….
Someone should tell ESPN and other ‘reporters’ that he doesn’t need to outplay Brady, he needs to outplay the Patriots defense and score more points against them. which he didn’t do.
"Leave the gun. Bring the Canolis."
“Someone should tell ESPN and other ‘reporters’ that he doesn’t need to outplay Brady, he needs to outplay the Patriots defense and score more points against them. which he didn’t do.”
Someone should also tell ALL the Steeler fans that said Joe can’t beat Ben (and many people here know they are guilty of saying that)
I always hated this theory that the QBs are going against eachother when their performances have nothing to do with eachother.
It wasn’t Ben that gave Joe problems, it was your incredible defense that gave him problems. He was able to finally overcome those demons in convincing fashion and in my opinion that was a major step in becoming the type of Quarterback that I think he definitely can become. Gotta improve from here on.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
by Mr MaLoR on Jan 28, 2012 1:11 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree
It is a process. That kind of thing can get in somebody’s head. That demon has been exorcised. Now I have a question for you and would like your input.
I have had a couple conversations with different people and a topic has come up that I think has some validity. It appears as though the Ravens had been built and prepared to beat the Steelers. This was evident in the Gatorade Showers after the wins. All of the talk out of Baltimore seemed to be focusing on (in almost a tunnel-vision-like fashion) the Steelers and no one else.
Well, fait accompli but at what cost? The Ravens put that effort to beat ONE team and lost to teams that were, shall we say inferior and ended up still missing out on the big prize. So my question is, do you think the Ravens put all of their eggs in one basket and ignored the big picture by putting too much emphasis on one opponent, or was this a necessary evil in order to take the next step?
Iron sharpeneth iron... Proverbs 27:17
It appears as though the Ravens had been built and prepared to beat the Steelers. This was evident in the Gatorade Showers after the wins. All of the talk out of Baltimore seemed to be focusing on (in almost a tunnel-vision-like fashion) the Steelers and no one else.
And I don’t really see the problem with that as most Steeler fans do. It seemed that over the previous 3 seasons, Pittsburgh was the one team in our way. We were fine against everyone else…..but Pittsburgh. You guys owned our asses year after year, so why not do something about it?
And as we saw this year by beating you guys twice, it gave us a far greater chance of reaching the Superbowl. One catch made or field goal kicked, and all that work we did to beat you guys pays off.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
so how do you rank him against the #1 defense against the pass?
first game against the steelers; 224 yards, 3 tds 17-29,
second game 300 yards 1 td 20-37.
I've been kind of busy
Otherwise, I’d do some better analysis. But our #1 pass ranking also had to do a lot with the poor offenses we played. In Y/G we faced 1 top 10 ranked pass offense, 2 top 16 (i.e. above average) pass offenses, and 7 bottom 10 ranked pass offenses.
Count me as unimpressed by that statistic.
I would say our pass offense was slightly above average this year and across the board we were better than the Ravens.
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
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by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
Exactly as lamberts58 says above
How does he rank against us? The #1 pass defense? Well he kinda kicked our ass didn’t he? Now I absolutely abhor the Ravens, and Joe Flacco, and his stupid unibrow, and his stupid Fu, BUT the kid has talent. Before you all kill me, hear me out.
This kid has been to the playoffs all FOUR of his starting years. Take away your hate of the Ravens, and doesn’t that become pretty significant? Let me tell you something, not even our #7 did that. People like to say, “Oh Flacco had that defense blah blah.” Well, Ben kinda had the same defense helping him out right?
Another annoying argument people bring up is comparing Roeth to Flacco or comparing Flacco to the “elite.” TBH who freaking cares?! This kid wins for the Ravens and takes them to playoffs, and following his track record, its been 100% of the time. Sure he hasn’t made it to the big dance, but he gives his team a chance, just like Ben does. I love the Steelers and Ben, but why is it when Ben has a shitty game, we cut him slack, like it’s cool, he has two rings. However, Flacco has a bad game, people come out with this mess like he’s been crap all along. It doesn’t matter if we like the kid or give him his due diligence or not, this kid is the starting QB for the Ravens and instead of wasting our offseason spouting about how garbage he is, how about we find ways to stop him. All those Ravens fans are sitting smug in their chairs, yeah upset that they lost the chance to go to the SB, but they still kicked our asses twice. All the years previous don’t matter ‘cause now they’ve found a QB for themselves, and they know he’s good, and we know he’s good, not counting the ones who see everything in black and gold.
Flacco is a legit QB for the Ravens, guys. As much as I don’t want him to be, he is. There used to be a time when I would see him drop back and he’d be scared of our defense. When he drived down the field in the waning moments of that second game, I finally felt how other teams felt when Ben would lead us down the field against them, without any type of fear or pressure. So about instead of bitching about how good or crappy a QB Flacco is, we bring him down to Earth, regardless. I want to see him scared of our defense again, and if next season, we scrape them off the grass like we’re used to, we can go back to saying he sucked. Because honestly, he beat us, I don’t care how he did it, or with what defense, or blah blah, I still can’t live it down. You can’t talk smack about the guys that beat you, that’s just childish. You gotta own up to is and put them back in their place. They’ve put all their pieces in place just to beat us, we can’t just take solace in saying, “Oh its okay they’ve beat us, they can’t beat anyone else.” Where is your pride, men?! Their sweep of us hurts man, it hurts deep. Anyways, random rant over, pardon the grammar, spellings, etc. And don’t hate on me too hard for defending the guy a little bit. Go Steelers!
This is Pittsburgh Steeler Troy Polamalu getting knocked around by the Pacific Ocean in Hawaii yesterday...
Minutes later, Troy caught the ocean going over the middle and smacked it right in the mouth. The ocean fumbled, Troy recovered and ran it into the endzone. The ocean never messed with Troy again.
by paulamalu on Jan 28, 2012 4:12 AM EST reply actions 8 recs
You have some valid points.
But dude, he has a unibrow AND a 70’s porn mustache. To pull that look off he needs AT LEAST one ring. He is a good quarterback on a good team. He beat us twice this year… but there is no ring for that. Count up the years Ben and the Steelers beat them twice or even three times and look at Championships. He has a long way to go before he catches Ben.
"I've been trying to justify you, in the end i will just defy you" Dream Theater
by OhioYinzer on Jan 28, 2012 9:12 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
+ This
He’s not perfect but he’s developing into the type of QB that a franchise can depend on. Like you, I want him to see flashbacks of Woodley, Timmons and Harrison for weeks after we play them. I want him to hear phantom footsteps in his dreams. (Harrison played a monster game against the Ravens in Nov. His first game back after the orbital fracture and IIRC he had 3 convincing sacks)
It’s up to the Steelers to continue the tradition of making Flacco a marginal QB against us…. because Flacco is fighting it every game he plays.
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
Hey, I hear ya
The only reason I was curious about this was that it was hi performance in the AFCCG that got all the pundits talking about him as an elite QB. Not even his two quality performances against us got him that respect in the national media.
Personally, I hope that everyone gives him all kinds of credit this year, and his expectations get raised, because with raised expectations comes increased pressure. We’ll see if he can handle it.
Finally, yes, he did perform well against the Steelers this year. But, the Ravens hired a consultant specifically to find out how they could beat the Steelers. That was a huge goal of theirs this year. Like Tomlin said, they know more about us than we do about them. With a new OC this year, expect that to change.
Anyway, I don’t see this as talking smack. I just wanted to see if his performance was really as great as everyone said. From what I can tell, I don’t see it, especially when you factor in that Brady had one of his worst days all year.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 28, 2012 10:17 AM EST up reply actions
Sorry Wolfpack
I didn’t mean to direct this towards you or anything. I was just letting out some steam, and this seemed like the perfect post. I really hope we make the changes necessary to start kicking Baltimore’s ass again.
This is Pittsburgh Steeler Troy Polamalu getting knocked around by the Pacific Ocean in Hawaii yesterday...
Minutes later, Troy caught the ocean going over the middle and smacked it right in the mouth. The ocean fumbled, Troy recovered and ran it into the endzone. The ocean never messed with Troy again.
It was a good, rantin' poast
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
<3
Want to make this my sig…
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Lol Relax
Ben still has moar rings
This is Pittsburgh Steeler Troy Polamalu getting knocked around by the Pacific Ocean in Hawaii yesterday...
Minutes later, Troy caught the ocean going over the middle and smacked it right in the mouth. The ocean fumbled, Troy recovered and ran it into the endzone. The ocean never messed with Troy again.
you should, yours is certainly not long enough, and I don’t think your obsession with how cute Joe looks in his pornstache has gotten quite to “sleeping with the enemy” levels yet.
I admit, I just don’t know who Joe is as a person, and I don’t know whether he wears briefs or boxers, so I may just be biased.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Devil's advocate or my real opinions?
See what I said above about our #1 ranked pass defense. It’s shocking how bad the opponents we played were.
Since when has making the playoffs been considered impressive? Winning the big games on your hand is what’s impressive to me. Joe definitely did that this game (Evans dropped it), but as we’ve said against a really bad defense. What else has Joe done in the playoffs? His rookie year he threw 1 TD and 3 INTs and didn’t have a game with above 50% comp rate. Or his sophomore year he threw 3 INTs and no TDs. Or his junior year where he completely collapsed against the Steelers when the game was looking like a blowout. Sure, he’s made it to the playoffs a lot, but he hasn’t done a lot with it. What I see when I look at his playoff numbers are 54.3% completion, 1to1 ratio for TD-INT, a low Y/A, and a poor Y/G total.
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
Follow me on Twitter
by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
Sure, he’s made it to the playoffs a lot, but he hasn’t done a lot with it.
But he has done alot more than most QB’s in this league have. We see all this love for Ryan, Romo, Freeman, Cutler, Vick, etc. Yet, name me on accomplishment those QB’s have done in the last 4 years that is more significant than what Joe has?
I understand that Steeler fans and many other fan bases with top notch QB’s judge everything based off the Lombardi trophy, but why can’t there be another level of measurement for QB’s who haven’t won a SB…..yet?
What I see when I look at his playoff numbers are 54.3% completion, 1to1 ratio for TD-INT, a low Y/A, and a poor Y/G total.
The numbers don’t lie, but everyone has to admit that they were somewhat impressed by Flacco’s performance in the playoffs for THIS season.
Not saying this was stated by just Steeler fans, but first it was “Joe can’t beat Ben.” Scratched. Then it became “Joe is horrific in the playoffs.” Scratched. So he made some progress, hopefully it continues.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
You’d be hard pressed to find many fans here who would rant about Ryan, Romo, or Cutler. And I know I’ve always been one of the biggest Vick haters. Even then, Vick has arguably better playoff numbers. I suppose, I’m more talking about Flacco being put in the same comparisons of Ben, Brady, Brees, Manning, Eli, and Rodgers. I think a more solid argument could be made that he belongs with the group you listed than the one I listed.
Using the word “impressed” is an overstatement to me. In his game against Houston he still had mediocre numbers with a poor comp%, Y/A, and total yards. He failed on multiple occasions to put that game away. If Schaub was playing that game it would have looked completely different.
I just don’t think I will ever be sold on Flacco being anything but a slightly above average QB.
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
Follow me on Twitter
by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
I suppose, I’m more talking about Flacco being put in the same comparisons of Ben, Brady, Brees, Manning, Eli, and Rodgers.
But I don’t think anyone has ever done this (expect Mr. Tales from the Crypt John Clayton), so why is it continually brought up in these discussions across the entire media system?
I just don’t think I will ever be sold on Flacco being anything but a slightly above average QB.
This doesn’t surprise me.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
This doesn’t surprise me.
Can you blame me? He finally gets the well rounded WR core you had been dreaming of and has one of the best pass catching RBs in the league. He proceed to have the worst comp% of his career, the least TDs since his rookie year, more INTs than last year, the worst Y/A of his career, and has a big drop off in QB rating compared to the last two years. I just don’t see it.
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
Follow me on Twitter
by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
Can you blame me?
Not at all. Part of the hate between these two teams.
He finally gets the well rounded WR core you had been dreaming of and has one of the best pass catching RBs in the league.
I agree this is the best WR core we have ever had, but still a completely new and extremely inexperienced group that I think will only get better. What was seen from Torrey and the 2 TE’s after a lockout is only going to improve down the road, which entail means Joe will improve.
Ask most Ravens fans (and even a bunch of experts and analysts) and they will tell you Joe is right where we want him to be entering his 5th season.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Thanks for the honest comment:
“So about instead of bitching about how good or crappy a QB Flacco is, we bring him down to Earth, regardless. I want to see him scared of our defense again, and if next season, we scrape them off the grass like we’re used to, we can go back to saying he sucked”
And honestly, that’s exactly what your team should do. It is the best thing you could do for Joe. In response to pressure, I’ve seen him develop immensly over the four years he’s been our quarterback. I have a good feeling that Joe’s progress comes in steps. Once he’s attained one (no longer looking like a deer in the headlights), he seems to be done with that step then moves on to the next one.
As I keep stating on here repeatedly, I love the AFC North because there are two really good teams in in that make great football, and make each other better football teams. Not to mention the other two teams on the rise. Can any of you honestly say that you would want the Ravens in some other division and out of your way? I can’t imagine not having this rivalry. How lucky are we?
Joe is consistantly improving. This season, he’s gotten us about as close as you can get to the dance. His best days are ahead of him. I say, bring it on Steelers and I hope you do. But I don’t think Joe is gonna suck and you should hope he doesn’t.
Formerly 88Keys
I like the Ravens in the AFC North...
…and would be perfectly happy with the status quo: Flacco to suck just enough for us to at least split with Ravens on annual basis – lol !
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
I feel the same way...
It’s why every Raven/Steelers game i say “good luck Steelers fans, but just a wee little bit less luck than us”
Formerly 88Keys
From what I saw
Flacco did what he had to do to put his team in a position to win, but his teammates couldn’t do their part (thankyousoverymuch, Misters Lee Evans & Billy Cundiff). He drove the team down the field when they needed it most and made some very good decisions and passes.
At the end of the day, going up against a D good enough to be in the Superbowl, what more can you ask for? I think he will gain confidence from this, and as a Steelers fan, I don’t like it.
(Somewhat surprised that our favorite closet Steeler fan hasn’t chimed in yet. Usually this topic is total Malorbait)
Bound to cover just a little more ground.
But
That interception he threw early in the fourth quarter was a killer. They were dominating with the run and he makes a completely boneheaded throw. In retrospect the drop in the end zone and missed fg lost the game… but that pic was still bad.
"I've been trying to justify you, in the end i will just defy you" Dream Theater
by OhioYinzer on Jan 28, 2012 10:20 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
That interception he threw early in the fourth quarter was a killer.
It hurt the rhythm a bit, but ints were the story of the playoffs for a bunch of teams. At least it wasn’t Rodgers or Brees terrible.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Yea, this year's AFCCG reminded me of last years...
…where T.J. Hoosh(whatever) and Bolden dropped key passes late in the game to prevent Flacco and the Ratbirds from possibly winning.
Flacco may be on his way to becoming an elite QB, or the 2000’s version of Dan Pastorini, who could never win the big one, ususally against the Steelers.
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
by PaVaSteeler on Jan 28, 2012 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
I could deal with the
Flacco may be on his way to becoming an elite QB
as long as the
who could never win the big one, ususally against the Steelers.
part applies as well. Getting swept this year would’ve been a lot more palatable if we would’ve been able to rally in the postseason and kick the ratbirds out of the playoffs once again. Just not to be this year, instead of rallying, we just got more and more beat up.
Bound to cover just a little more ground.
There DOES seem to be more than slight similarities between the Ravens and
The Oilers of the 70s.
Iron sharpeneth iron... Proverbs 27:17
True dat
and Flacco threw some inaccurate passes here and there as well. Some of which probably could’ve been picked, but weren’t
However, it’s not like BB, or even the members of the “elite” QB triumvirate of Prince Brady, Manning, or Breesus haven’t thrown the odd untimely pic in the playoffs either.
What they usually do, however, even if they throw a pic, is come back and put their team in the position to win. Flacco did that. (and again, I don’t like it)
Bound to cover just a little more ground.
Cool post.
Appreciate the sensible ones here who realize that just because he is the ugliest QB in the league, doesn’t do pregame chants or Uggs ads and is from a small school doesn’t mean he sucks.
Here is a quality story comparing Flacco to some of the greats in their first 4 seasons (including your precious Ben). Just stats alone, you have to be impressed. He already has a top 20 QB rating of all time.
http://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2012/1/2/2677440/joe-flacco-a-comparison-study
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Careful how high the horse is your choosing to get up on
“Precious Ben” manages to pull out the wins when it counts; to date… Flacco… not so much. (and before you start yell about dropped passes and special teams errors…. Ben has his share of “not his faults” too.)
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
No one is taking away Ben’s accomplishments, the guy is a winner in every form.
But winning Superbowls is a damn tough thing to do, there are only 26 QB’s in history to hold the Lombardi. Joe has come damn close, something a large majority of QB’s in this league would kill for.
And I only say precious Ben because he is your guy and every Steeler fans loves him for what he has done.
I am the same way with Joe, he is my QB, the only one in my lifetime that I have had give me hope, and I will always support him because of that.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
by Mr MaLoR on Jan 28, 2012 1:01 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It’s too bad you weren’t around for the Unitas years. Don’t take that the wrong way, I think Flacco is a lot better than he is given credit for at BTSC.
"They timed it perfectly, they just went too soon." - Darrell Waltrip commenting on an illegal restart.
Who wouldn’t have wanted to have Unitas as there QB? Ive heard and seen enough about him to realize how dominant he was.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Relax, after your:
my QB, the only one in my lifetime that I have had give me hope
I was just saying that it’s a shame that as a Baltimore fan, you weren’t able to be a part of that.
"They timed it perfectly, they just went too soon." - Darrell Waltrip commenting on an illegal restart.
I wasn’t getting tensed up over your comment. Was simply stating that I am aware of what I missed out on, and agreeing with you.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
that say volumes
of how inept our talent evaluators were before Noll took over. They cut Unitas… yep that pretty well sums it up.
Horseshoes and hand grenades
Joe has come damn close
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
Not a bad article
The main thing he’s missing, and what, in my mind, makes Ben an elite QB, is SB trips and wins.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 28, 2012 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
Yup. Just getting to a Superbowl is such an impressive feat, and Ben has done that many time.
I think Joe just getting to a Superbowl would give him the respect he deserves. It sucks ecause he did everything we could ask for last Sunday and had his best game as a Raven and people are going to forget that because he wasn’t on the winning side.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
by Mr MaLoR on Jan 28, 2012 1:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
History is after all...
…written by the winners.
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
We'll see
Long range, if he makes it to one and loses, he’ll probably looked at like McNabb.
I will say this though, if I were a Ravens fan, I would think as you do. He’s done good enough so far in his career that you have hope that he will improve to really put you over the top. On the other hand, as a Steelers fan, he reminds me more of Neil O’Donnell than Terry Bradshaw or Ben.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 28, 2012 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
he reminds me more of Neil O’Donnell than Terry Bradshaw or Ben.
BURN!!!
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
Ugggghhh Bradshaw, worst statistically winning Superbowl QB of all time. But he won…
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
by Mr MaLoR on Jan 28, 2012 5:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'll take a guy who wins 4 SBs anytime
you would too, and you know it.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 28, 2012 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
Bradshaw is one of the best ever, that’s why he is in the HOF. But man were some of those stats ugly in a bunch of seasons. But that was 70’s football, so it wasn’t unusual.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
C'mon...
You know the only numbers we count in Pittsburgh is Championships. Stats = Style points in our eyes.. lol
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
Well aware
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
I don't give change back to the clerk...
…if the bills are wrinkled and dirty; money is money…
…wins are wins (ugly or not).
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
A) He’s not even close to the worst statistically, that would probably be Joe Namath
B) How come stats don’t matter to you when you’re defending average Joe’s 50% completion percentage, or lack of td passes and high number of int’s? But now they do when bringing up another quarterback that you are less attracted to/obsessed with?
Never mind, of course I already know the answer to that, we’ve went over this before.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
worst statistically...
yet he managed to be SB MVP twice and was league MVP one year. Something tells me that Bradshaw would be lighting the league up like a pinball game if he could play in this age where touching a QB is taboo.
For as good as Flacco played
against and poor defense, which is not a ‘superbowl’ defense the patriots are there because of their offense not their defense, he threw it all away with that pick. It was a completely terrible throw, the WR had no chance of making the catch and I had no idea what flacco saw to make him throw it there. But what that pick does is waste time, resets the Ravens back to the 20 and start over, only because Brady threw a pick right after that. But hadn’t flacco thrown that pick, the ravens would have won the game. Don’t get me wrong, not trying to take blame away from cundiff nor evans. That pick changed the course of that game that lead to where it was, had he not thrown it there would have been a different ending, different playcalling since playcalling is determined a lot of times by the clock, which in turns would leave to different defense being played. Elite QBs doesn’t throw interceptions in the 4th quarter in big games. Elite QBs don’t look completely lost against great defenses like the texans. Flacco is getting better but I truly don’t know what his ceiling is and thats the problem. Every time he looks good, he still throws these bonehead throws where its like what in the world. This isn’t just one bad game this is several games. Like it was said before, he reminds me of neil o donnel. He’s good enough to for you to be a good team but I highly doubt the defense will be good enough for him to win a Super Bowl.
I love the Steelers.
Hater
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
I guess my issue
is its been what 4-5 years and he has improved very moderately. We keep waiting for Joe to just break out and play like he did against the Steelers on the last drive, in every single game. When is that going to happen? When is he going to stop having games like he did against the texans, seattle, jacksonville, and titans? Where he looks more like Sanchez than Eli manning. That is a legitimate question. Flacco has all the tools but there just seems like its something missing, if he can correct it in two years then its going have to be accepted that this is his ceiling. I say two years because it would be six years in and if he is still doing the same dumb stuff well – he’d plateaued. The next two years will tell the tale for Joe, especially when Ray hangs it up – he means so much to that entire team which is why he should be voted to the pro bowl even after he retires.
Sorry, think I laid it on real thick at the end there.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 29, 2012 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
should be
if he can’t correct it in two years
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 29, 2012 10:13 AM EST up reply actions
is its been what 4-5 years and he has improved very moderately. We keep waiting for Joe to just break out and play like he did against the Steelers on the last drive, in every single game. When is that going to happen? When is he going to stop having games like he did against the [jets], seattle, jacksonville, and titans?
Take a look at this post. The games listed above were Joe’s worst games of this season, right? He is in his fourth season and is supposed to not be having games like that because 4th year QB’s do not have games like those, right? This post will give you an idea that Joe is having the same ups and downs as most of the best QB’s of all time had in their first 4 seasons.
http://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2011/10/14/2489259/joe-flacco-vs-the-elite
This should give everyone an idea that Flacco has no where reached his peak as a QB, and to say he hasn’t improved over 4 seasons is absolutely insane. Flacco did things this season that we hadn’t seen from him the previous 3 seasons (won’t bring them up here though, too embarrassing for the ones who think he isn’t a top 20 QB).
Anyway, read through that post, it will give you an idea that having a few poor performances in your 4th season at 26 years old does not mean he is showed that he has improved moderately
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
You may be waiting a looooong time then...
We keep waiting for Joe to just break out and play like he did against the Steelers on the last drive, in every single game.
that “last drive” was a mistake by a Steeler in coverage that had nothing to do with Flacco’s throw; had the Steeler in question (Mr. Clark) been where he was supposed to be, chances are Flacco’s pass incomplete/broken up/intercepted.
Thus, your using that play as an example of AJF’s “break out” abilities is flawed.
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
That sentence was meant to be quoted from tanofsteel84, was not my saying.
that "last drive" was a mistake by a Steeler in coverage that had nothing to do with Flacco’s throw;
Not surprised you would say something dumb like that. All good, whatever helped ya get through it. I’d be pretty upset to if a below average QB with a unibrow from a D1AA school did that to me as well.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Get your panties unwadded MaLoR...
…if you can recall, I’ve posted several times I thought highly of Flacco.
I just wouldn’t call one play a precursor of greatness, especially when it came on a play with an acknowledged failure of coverage, thus diminishing the full awesomeness of what Flacco did.
United we Stand, melded like Steel
To Roger Goodell, We'll never Yield.
he can’t. He wants you to judge him on who he is as a person. That’s the only reason you’re hating on him. You don’t see when he helps little old ladies cross the street, or when he volunteers at the soup kitchen. When you say unkind words about Joe, you not only hurt his feelings, but you put Malor in a depression spiral where the only way out of it for him is to eat 2 gallons of ice cream and re-watch Joe’s “masterful” drive on a loop. Then after an hour or so of that, he watches the videos he made while stalking Joe outside of his bathroom window.
So, let’s watch what we say about Joe the great.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Seems like an incomplete comparison
In two ways:
1. As we all like to say, it’s difficult to compare against QBs from different eras, especially when you go back to the ’80’s and compare against Montana and Marino. Since 1978, there have been continuous rules changes to favor the passing game. However, the focus in the last 5 years or so has been ridiculous, to the point that 3 QBs passed for over 5000 yards this year, and, I believe, 2 of those passed Marino’s single season record. In 1989, I believe that Joe Montana set the passer rating record that season with a rating of around 112. Only 2 other QBs had better than 90. This year, all of the top 10 QBs in passer rating were 90 or higher, with 4 of them over 100.
2. Just selecting random games for these other players doesn’t give any context in terms of quality of defensive opponent.
So, yes, other great QBs have had down games, but that doesn’t really say if Flacco’s problem games from this year were comparable to those down games sited in that comparison.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 29, 2012 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
2. Just selecting random games for these other players doesn’t give any context in terms of quality of defensive opponent.
True, but lets also keep in mind that Flacco faced a top 10 defense in 13 of 18 games played this year. So that might be worthy of including in an assessment of Joe.
And it isn’t a comparison where as people are saying Flacco can be the next Montana, or Brady, or Peyton. It is simply making a point that there just so happens to be other GREAT quarterbacks in NFL history that did indeed have some struggles in their 4th season.
I understand some of it is from different eras, but I still get the sense when I come on here that most people think Flacco is the only QB to ever have a game like the ones in JAX, Seattle, NYJ.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Flacco faced a top 10 defense in 13 of 18 games played this year
If that point was highlighted in the BBD post, I missed it. If it wasn’t, it should have been, which would have helped with context. Anyway, yeah, I understand the point of the post. It just would have been more convincing with a little more context.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 29, 2012 5:33 PM EST up reply actions
I guess flacco's stat line next year
should be 70% comp. pct 5000 yards passing with 40 TDs and 3 INt.
should be fun to watch
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 29, 2012 9:32 PM EST up reply actions
What makes you think that?
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
he is so freakin good
and he is growin by leaps and bounds every year, there is no limit to his potential. Obviously he was just adjusting to his new weapons this year. Next year nothing is going to hold this Joe back, Torrey Smith is going to have 1500 yards receiving with 12 TDs, Boldin is going to have 1600 yards with 18 TDs and Ray rice will have 1200 yards Receiving.
He is going to win NFL MVP and the Ravens will go undefeated.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 29, 2012 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
No one here (including myself) ever said Flacco was the best out there and will put up those numbers. It’s funny to me that so many Steeler fans claim that Ravens fans consider Flacco an “elite” Quarterback, yet I never see one comment like this made here or on BB.
Why have you all of a sudden taken what has been said in this post to that sarcastic 16 year old level? Guess you are still adjusting to the realization that the guy upstairs being prayed to on Sundays wears a big 15 on his chest.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Malor
no matter what we say about him you are going to disagree with. We try to show his faults – you turn a blind eye and say we’re hating or underestimating him. So whats the point?
I’ve said he has improved moderately, which is the truth. Look at Rodgers development, you see clear improvment. I look at Flacco and I see the same guy the last three years. Then I go look at the numbers and it confirms it, same guy the last three years.
You talk about how much flacco improved this year but his completion percentage dropped to 57% this year, he threw more picks and had less touchdowns this year when compared to last year. Yet you sit there and want to argue with me when I said he improved moderately.
You won’t listen to facts in reason, instead you act like a 16 year old who was just told that his girlfriend was average but you want to contend she’s still hot. So I brought the conversation down to your level. You can’t handle stats, reason, or facts, so why even bother wasting the time.
As for my God, He does whatever He pleases (Psalm 115:3), I have no qualms about that. Tired of this whole Tebow and God stuff, it really just shows your own insecurity. Otherwise you wouldn’t feel the need to bring it up all the time.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 9:56 AM EST up reply actions
Then I go look at the numbers and it confirms it, same guy the last three years.
And he is most likely going to stay around those same numbers for most of his career. Flacco is never going to be a 4,500 yards, 38 TD QB….and it is not because he can’t do it, it is because our offense isn’t built that way. When you have a top 3 RB that is only 25 years old, he is going to be the focus.
Joe had an “off” year, but I am simply making the notion that we saw certain qualities about him this season that us Ravens fans hadn’t seen from him that make us even more antsy of whats to come from him when he reaches his 7th, 8th, 9th season.
You can’t handle stats, reason, or facts, so why even bother wasting the time.
I can handle stats, reason and facts, but some people being so certain that Flacco will always just be an “average QB on a good team” is what I do not agree with (which is the notion I took away from your comments.)
As for the Tebow thing, probably shouldn’t have gone there, my apologies. God bless.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Its all good Malor
I won’t deny he had some good quality and good stretches this year. He is a good QB I have never wavered on that this year.
I think it depends on what you think of average. There are 32 starting QBs in the league so if you are 16th-20th then you are dead average. 12th-15th is above average to me. 6th-11th you are a good QB. 1-5 you are elite.
Then there are guys on Espn that will say there are 10 elite QBs in the league and that is simply not true. You can’t be elite if 1/3 of the league is elite, elite by definition precludes a very small percentage of the population. The high end of a bell curve.
So hopefully that put it into perspective.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
2.
So I can’t look at over a quarter of the season? If it was just one or two bad games you could say I’m cherry picking but he’s had at least 5-6 bad games this year. Thats about half the season? So I"m just suppose to throw all that away and look at that he face top 10 defense in 13 of 18 games played?
So I’m suppose to look at only the good and not the bad? Then I’d be talking like Malor.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 10:00 AM EST up reply actions
I never said you have to do anything. I stated…
So that might be worthy of including in an assessment of Joe.
As in “take it how you wanna take it.”
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
its all good
I understand he is the best ya’ll ever had, while you have been alive. So expect you to have a lot of love for him, just like we have a lot of love for ben but he isn’t touching brees, brady, or Rodgers right now.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
I don't think anyone here
doesn’t believe he isn’t a top 20 QB, just most here don’t believe he is a top 10. Most think he is around 11-12 range. And if I look at it
Rodgers
Brady
Brees
Rivers
Ben
Eli
Vick
Peyton (if he still playing)
Stadford
Ryan
Flacco
Scuab
Romo
Cutler
Smith
So Its hard to argue that Flacco belongs in that 2nd teir. People are being objective here sorry that its your boy. No one is saying he sucks and he can’t play.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
stop it! you are just hating on Joe because you don’t know him as a person. He’s a kind caring teddy bear of a man, and you just aren’t appreciating him properly.
Can I get some hot sauce for my doughnut?
Funny… I say the same thing about Deebo. lol
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
flacco just needs to get reintegrated in his place in the linebacker sandwich
He clearly made the most of his opportunities this year against the Steelers and it is petty and embarrassing to denigrate his play right now. He played well but he had teammates let him down in the playoffs at least the last two years.
But the revenge pendulum is ready to swing in the opposite direction this year and it’s going to time for the ravens to eat the crap sandwich in 2012.
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
Franco Harris:
"If I had to choose today between the moral integrity and character of Joe Paterno and the politicians and commentators criticizing him, I would pick Joe Paterno, hands down, no contest every time."
Allow me to be petty then.
Flacco has never won a SB, despite the advantages of a top-notch supporting cast in recent years. He missed some key opportunities against the Pats, just as he typically does every time he faces a do-or-die situation.
It’s not enough to outplay the opposing QB statistically or to throw some sharp passes. The playoffs are about finding a way to win and Flacco failed the big test once again. Frankly, I don’t see this guy ever getting a SB ring.
You and LaMarr Woodley
I’d say that’s pretty good company. I hope you’re both correct, too.
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
I agree with the majority of what you said
But Lee Evans blew what couldve and by all rights shouldve been Joe’s big moment. The Steelers have been fortunate to have an abundance of players who perform in the clutch and relish big moments. The Ravens havent as much.
We have had guys like Ward, Holmes, and now Brown all step up for the big moment. The Lee Evans drop was a big time play by Flacco, but was dropped by small time Evans.
The magic wasnt there. Until they have that outstanding go-to WR who lives for the moment, I agree that Flacco will never get a ring.
The Ravens wanted to win and get to the Superbowl, yet they had no one who dared to be great
Formerly known as Steeler_
BTSC's token Kiwi fan. That means I'm a New Zealander. Yes, that small country next to Australia....no we are not part of Australia
by Michael Hewitt on Jan 29, 2012 9:05 PM EST up reply actions
Was it really a drop
Or a great plya by a DB? I mean it was bang-bang and the DB made a great play. .5 seconds longer and he secures it and it’s a TD. I don’t think it was Evans’ “fault” as much as it was a good defensive play.
Iron sharpeneth iron... Proverbs 27:17
+1
Everyone blames it on Evans, but I thought it was a great defensive play as well.
"Leave the gun. Bring the Canolis."
Agree completely
Finish. The. Play. .. and your team goes to the Super Bowl. Too bad Evans didn’t get that memo.
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
Little off topic
It was really great seeing our guys at the Pro Bowl this year. AB pulled aside by Larry Fitz and seeing a moment where Fitz is recognizing AB for his play (although he really sucks at Corner… keep your WR day job, AB)
Ray Lewis actually CHEERING for AB when he was taking the kick back (I thought he was taking it to the house too, Ray) Lewis cheered so much another player said “Hey! I never heard you yell like that for a Steeler.”
It was pretty cool.
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
It was great seeing all the stars of the NFL try to play Special Teams and stop Brown. Every return was about 50 yards.
That one long return Brown had that you are talking about, Ray was repeatedly screaming “He’s housing it! He’s housing it!”
That was actually a rather entertaining pro bowl. They were playing soft in the 1st quarter, but once it started getting close and people started doing trick plays and going for it on 4th down, some hitting started to come out.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Yea
I agree I actually enjoyed watching most of it, I didn’t turn after the 2nd quarter. Felt bad that they were booing Cam though. First pro bowl and you get booed? Thats pretty tough, although some of those throws were awful, I don’t know how much of it was nerves or how much of it just shows the brilliance of Carolina’s coaches staff to get that type of performance out of him this year.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah that's the one.
I had to laugh when he was running down the sidelines skipping. He must have said “He’s housing it!” 20 times… As much as I hate it; Ray Lewis is timeless and I really do like him.
I actually enjoyed the game too. I figured I’d watch the first quarter until Ben and the Offense was pulled but it was nice to see after the very lack-luster play was boo’ed in the 1st that they picked up their game. I wouldn’t say they were going “all out” but… they sure were getting after Newton. What I wouldn’t give for Von Miller…. that man is a beast. Thoroughly enjoy watching him play.
HERE WE GO STEELERS!
"Our Father, who art in Pittsburgh, Football be thy game. Thy Kingdom come, thy will be done, at Heinz Field as it is in Heaven. Give us this day, a stellar D and forgive us our bogus fines, as we (sorta) forgive Goodell who trespasses against us. And lead us not into defeat, but deliver us a Victory. For thine is The Steelers, the power and glory of climbing the STAIRWAY TO 7."
Flacco
I would say the top 4 QB’s (in no order) are: Brady, Manning, Brees, Rodgers. The next guys (in no order) would be: Roethlisberger, Eli, Rivers, Newton, Stafford, and Shaub. Flacco is probably 11-12. Flacco is not an “Elite” quarterback. He’s been in the playoffs, but how many has he won? I would say he’s like Tony Romo (you know, the guy who can’t win the big one), but that would be an insult. I’d trust Flacco over Romo because I think Flacco is more dedicated to being a winning quarterback while Romo is more dedicated to being loved for being the quarterback of “America’s Team.”
Now, let’s pause for a second. Let’s look at the Raven’s WRs. Torrey Smith, Anquan Boldin, and Lee Evans. Smith is young, Evans is a career under-achiever, and Boldin lost his luster without having Fitzgerald lined up opposite of him. Look at every other QB I have listed ahead of Flacco. At some point, they have all had an “elite” WR. Brady – Gronkowski, Welker, Moss, Ocho. Manning – Wayne, Harrison. Brees – Colston. Rodgers – Driver, Jennings. Ben – Wallace, Brown, Holmes. Eli – Cruz, Nicks, Burress. Rivers – Gates, Jackson. Newton – Smith. Shaub – Johnson. Stafford – Megatron.
Give credit here to what Flacco has done with what he has had. More importantly, with the emergence of Torrey Smith and a possible upgrade either through free agency or the draft….think about what Flacco’s potential could be.
Give credit here to what Flacco has done with what he has had
This has been the “excuse” though that Steeler fans like to throw back in our face. Everyone here is a aware that your offense is supposed to be top 10 with 3 rookie WR and 2 TE’s who caught a combined 11 passes last year along with a #1 WR who is really just a very good #2.
Don’t make too much sense around here now….
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
I'm sorry
I think half of that is because you and your ravens friends tell us how awesome your WRs are. Every single freakin year. When you got boldin, he was going to get 1200 yards receiving that year, Lee Evans, and now Torrey Smith. So don’t try to down play the WRs now to make Joe look good after they didn’t meet expectations when before you was giving them all the hype.
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Jan 30, 2012 10:05 AM EST up reply actions
Our pass catches are pretty awesome, but that didn’t mean they were experienced. Evans got hurt, Boldin is a shell of his old self (but still solid) and then we had the rookies. Did I hype them up in the offseason? Probably. Have I now realized that just because they are Ravens doesn’t exempt them from going through growing pains? Definitely.
Flacco has to trust his receivers to make catches, but shouldn’t throw towards coverage. He needs to attack deep more often, but shouldn’t hold onto the ball so long. He needs to show more awareness in the pocket and move to extend plays, but nothing good comes of him leaving the pocket. He should run with the ball if nobody’s open, but he definitely can’t run with the ball.
Flacco should have the awareness of Roethlisberger, the elusiveness of Vick, the control of the offense of Manning, the leadership of Brady, the accuracy of Brees, and the arm strength of … Flacco? - Ampallang
Boldin
IIRC, wasn’t he the youngest WR to 500 catches? or the fastest? He was certainly considered an elite WR before going to the Ravens. We’re not talking about Alvin Harper here.
by WolfpackSteelersFan on Jan 30, 2012 10:13 PM EST up reply actions
Flacco is Wacko
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
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by John Stephens on Jan 30, 2012 10:16 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
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