An alternative to drafting a NT
BTSC is truly in offseason mode nowadays, and I figured i'd help stir the pot a little. It seems to be the popular consensus that the steelers should be targeting Dontari Poe out of Memphis with their first rounder this year, due to the retirement of Chris Hoke and Hamptons injury and general roundness. I feel that there is one alternative being overlooked, and I don't mean moving Ziggy to NT.
How do you replace one of the best 3-4 NT's of all time, and an All-Pro level player? Why not look in the direction of a player who not only participated in this years Pro Bowl, but also a guy who is a free agent this year. I'm talking about Paul Soliai.
While Soliai is a bit tall for the NT position, Soliai's incredible strength allows him to take up double teams and play the run great, he also show's the athleticism of a much younger Hampton. Soliai has the work ethic that Steelers fan's love, a guy who's worked very hard to become the player he is today after being drafted in the 4th round (ala Aaron Smith or even Keisel). Adding to the chip on his shoulder Soliai was forced to go the way of Community College before getting a shot at the NFL, Soliai was something of a legend around the JuCo's playing for Coffeyville (very close to wichita where I stay). I don't think it would be very hard to persuade a guy like Soliai to come to a place where he could be the starter day one for a perennial super bowl contender and top defense, as opposed to the Dolphins who rarely compete in their division. Adding him to a line with Keisel, Heyward and Hood solidifies the D - line for several years whilst allowing the Colbert to concentrate their efforts on other needs such as the O-Line and a ILB.
I don't feel like Hampton will be ready to start the season on time this year, and I also don't feel as if he is worthy to be retained at his current price tag. Grabbing a younger player and most likely a upgrade would be in the best interest of the team. Hampton has been a warrior and perhaps deserves a little more loyalty from us, but that's another discussion all together.
I also recognize that players of Soliais caliber aren't cheap, but I trust Colbert and the front office could move things around to get the space. Losing Hampton as well as either Farrior or Foote would go a long way, as well as restructuring some guys. Also backloading his contract is an option I believe.
I would love to hear a few guys thoughts on this, also if you guys don't like him as a NT he did play some guard in college lol
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From walterfootball.com
At 6-4, 355 pounds, Paul Soliai is a monstrous, run-stuffing nose tackle. He made $12.3 million with the franchise tag this season
The idea sounds very appealing but looks like he made a lot of $ last year when he was franchised and he looks to be getting “the big deal” this year. He may be out of the Steelers’ price range unfortunately. Nonetheless, this is a great idea and is different from most of the other conventional solutions to NT.
Do you know what level of free agency he is? (unrestricted, restricted, etc)
Also from walterfootball.com (find this a bit funny)
Kraig Urbik missed some time with a sprained MCL, but didn’t permit a single sack in 2011. He played effectively at center once Eric Wood went down.
Kraig Urbik getting 3 stars and the 5th best OG prospect for free agency in 2012.
Hmmmm….so was Urbik not the appropriate fit into the Steeler Offense, was he released too soon, better fit for the Bills O, or a late bloomer?
We blew it on Urbik
Ben would not be limping so much if we had a good OL. We are paying him $100M over the life of the contract and there were folding chairs infront of him last year.
by Steeler Nation VA on Feb 1, 2012 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
You know the OL is all about togetherness and chemestry
Urbik just didn’t fit in. At training camp, he was always standing by himself. Don’t know why, but that’s the way it was. I remember making a comment to Rebecca Rollet about it, when we were watching from the stands.
"They timed it perfectly, they just went too soon." - Darrell Waltrip commenting on an illegal restart.
Yeah Urbik has been EXTREMELY solid
Think he maybe just needed a change of scenery, he excels in the zone blocking scheme they use.
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by Wichita SunSteeler on Feb 1, 2012 11:04 AM EST up reply actions
We blew it with Urbik.
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by John Stephens on Feb 1, 2012 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
Hindsight is 20/20 and all that but, I think we blew that one too.
Just not sure who we would have cut instead of him. (Legs, Foster, Kemo)
Anyone got a time machine
I definitely wouldn’t mind seeing Kemo go
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by Wichita SunSteeler on Feb 1, 2012 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
Essex?
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by John Stephens on Feb 1, 2012 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
I believe he was already off the team, but had to be brought back on due to injuries. Sort of like Starks but a bit earlier than Max’s situation.
I'm too lazy to find out what our 53 was
haha
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by John Stephens on Feb 1, 2012 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
completely agree
Not sure why they let Urbik go, but was a really bad move. I made it a point to watch him very closely in the preseason and this kid always held a block and was very consistent. I can remember one game where the steelers played the Redskins and not only did he help the offensive tackle with the initial block to level the DT, he then peeled off to go about 10 yards downfield and completely flattened the linebacker and Redman basically walked into the endzone on the play.
Disagree
Urbik blew it with us. He didnt fit our schemes well, and failed to separate himself from his competition on the Offensive Line. He got his second chance with the Bills and he has made the most of it.
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by Michael Hewitt on Feb 2, 2012 4:50 AM EST up reply actions
I think bad coaching might have played a part. I wish he had gotten a year under Kugler.
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by John Stephens on Feb 2, 2012 8:56 AM EST up reply actions
what schemes is that?
run block and pass block. pull, slide, etc. you run and pass block as an offensive lineman. He did it well, and they screwed up by letting him go. It’s okay
hes unrestricted, been in the league 4 years.
wouldve left last year but got franchised, the dolphins were unable to reach an agreement with him during this season to stay. Also that 12 million is pretty bloated, thank Haynesworth for that one. Ive heard some creative ways the steelers could get under the cap though, alot of it starts with releasing guys like Kemo etc. before their salaries are on the books
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by Wichita SunSteeler on Feb 1, 2012 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
Great idea, but...
1) Are the Dolphins just going to let him walk? If so, great, snatch him up, but I expect his price to be more than the Steelers want to pay.
2) How can they sign anyone significant when they are 20 million over the cap? Obviously, cuts will have to be made, Hampton being one of them, but there’s a lot more cutting that will need to take place just to get under the cap…let alone sign a free agent.
3) If the Dolphins were to let him test the market, I’m sure the Steelers would have to outbid at least 1 other suiter. I’m sure another team would not let a player with his talent slide off their radar.
If the Steelers sign a free agent NT, it will likely be another 3-4 team’s backup.
Yeah im sure he would be pretty coveted this offseason
The dolphis already lost their opportunity to keep him I beleive after failing to work out a deal during his Franchise Tag year,
I stated it earlier, but ive heard some pretty creative ways it just depends on who we can restructure like Hines. Letting go of guys like Foote, Will Allen, Madison and Hampton etc. Plus Aaron Smiths contract going away.
Not sure we can outbid anyone though
5/02/2006The night Raja Bell's Clothesline was heard around the world -- I STILL REMEMBER!
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by Wichita SunSteeler on Feb 1, 2012 11:00 AM EST up reply actions
What are we going to pay him with?
We are $25,000,000 over the cap. We have no ammunition in free agency. While teams like Tampa may be $25M or more under the cap and can throw money at holes in their roster, we are shooting a squirt gun.
Hate to burst your bubble. But reality will hit the roster come March when we have to get under the cap.
by Steeler Nation VA on Feb 1, 2012 10:59 AM EST reply actions
Yeah I understant the cap difficulties were facing.
Im optimistic our front office can creatively fix that problem though, I think we could get him for $8 million. Or maybe throw him alot of guaranteed money/back-load the contract.
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by Wichita SunSteeler on Feb 1, 2012 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
Good idea, but virtually impossible to accomplish
It’s not a bad suggestion, but I agree with Steeler Nation here…I just don’t think we can clear that kind of cap room. It’ll be relatively easy to clear enough under the cap for draft picks, retain our restricted free agents and get a couple of min-sal free agents (I made a post about this earlier this offseason).
But trying to sign this guy at the $8m or so he is going to command (or even a 1st year cap hit of $5m or so) would be exceedingly difficult if not virtually impossible. The money just isn’t there this year.
add to that
the $25M is just to get under the cap by March with an incomplete roster.
After that you need maybe $8m for RFA tenders, $4M for draftees, and a couple million for any budget UFA vets they pick up.
If you cut Hampton, Kemo, Ward, Farrior, Foote, A. Smith, J. Scott, BMac, Suisham, Battle and W. Allen, you only get $27M in cap relief.
They’re going to need to restructure numerous guys to get enough room just to field a decent team. When you restructure those guys and add cash to their bonus money, you’re rolling the dice there. If they get seriously injured and need to be cut, then the team eats all the remaining bonus money at once.
Another smaller money way to help is to sign the RFA guys to longer contracts that are back-loaded to minimize the cap hit that would accompany the tender if they don’t sign.
by Steely McSmash on Feb 1, 2012 10:31 PM EST up reply actions
numbers
from a 2012 roster/cap post in SteelersDepot
by Steely McSmash on Feb 1, 2012 10:31 PM EST up reply actions
great idea...
but it will take some work!!! i think we’re well overdue for an impact free agent!!!(Kevin Greene, farior, the bus, ect…)
by moonsteeler on Feb 1, 2012 11:00 AM EST via Android app reply actions
The Bus was a trade with the Rams for a 2nd round pick
by Steeler Nation VA on Feb 1, 2012 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
4th round for bettis..
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by nycsteelerfan on Feb 1, 2012 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
talk about a steal
I love the Steelers.
by tannofsteel84 on Feb 1, 2012 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
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by Steeler Nation VA on Feb 2, 2012 10:27 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah I think the FO makes moves like this, but only when it makes complete sense
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by Wichita SunSteeler on Feb 1, 2012 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
Not going to happen...
Can you name any time in the Kevin Colbert era where the Steelers looked at the top Free Agent at any position. Soliai is going to get paid and the Steelers don’t have room to do that.
Huge fan of the Steelers. (that includes "Steelers West")
"If I could start my life over again, I would be a professional football player and you better damn well believe a Pittsburgh Steeler!"- Jack Lambert
Alternatives to your alternative
1) New York Jets – Sione Pouha. The Jets may let him walk, as they have drafted Kenrick Ellis to take his place. Pouha won’t command the salary Solai will. He’s not as much of an impact player as Solai or the next guy I’m going to mention…
2) San Diego Chargers – Antonio Garay. Again, the Chargers have a little depth with Cam Thomas, they may let Garay walk. I think the Chargers try to keep him, which may price the Steelers out of the market. Either way, the most expensive one of the 3 options, and least likely.
3) Baltimore Ravens – Brandon McKinney. The Ravens are stacked on Defense. A quick offer might slide under the radar.
Isn’t Ellis about to get deported?
"It's football the way it's meant to be played. That's who Pittsburgh is, and that's who Pittsburgh has always been."
-- so says Rex Ryan.
The case should get dropped because from what I’ve read, Ellis sounds like he did nothing wrong. It sounds as if he protected his girlfriend from some drunk asshole with a baseball bat.
"If you havin' dragon problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 arrows but my knee took one."
The drunk guy attacked Ellis and his girlfriend with the bat. Ellis then proceeded to beat the snot out of the punk who attacked his girl (iirc).
"If you havin' dragon problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 arrows but my knee took one."
I would have done the same thing
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by Michael Hewitt on Feb 2, 2012 4:51 AM EST up reply actions
It is a brilliant idea if only we had some money
He will require $10 million a year to sign and we have NO where near that much money. However, if we could sign him to a 4 or 5 year deal and put most of his money in the 2014 and beyond part of his contract (when the cap will likely go up 50 or so million dollars a year) then it MIGHT be possible but still highly unlikely.
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by seton hall and steelers on Feb 1, 2012 4:45 PM EST reply actions
do they still have the rule about no more than 30% increase in base year to year?
if he got 10 mil guaranteed, and 30% raises to average $10M/year he’d start with a $4.4M base which would give a cap hit of $6.4M with 1/5 the bonus.
by Steely McSmash on Feb 1, 2012 10:36 PM EST up reply actions
Too expensive.
"If you havin' dragon problems I feel bad for you son, I got 99 arrows but my knee took one."
We'd have a chance any other year
Other thanTHIS year, where we are already $25 mil over the cap.
Stay thirsty my friends.
Unfortunately, he will command big money
Right now, we struggle to find little money
Formerly known as Steeler_
BTSC's token Kiwi fan. That means I'm a New Zealander. Yes, that small country next to Australia....no we are not part of Australia
Said it before and I'll say it again
No way the Steelers draft a NT in the first round or go after an elite tier FA. I’d give it a snowball’s chance in hell that they commit first round dollars to all 3 positions along the front. It simply does not make financial sense.
"In football, there are football players and there are footballs. A lot of times in football, a football player will be running with a football, and a lot of times, he carries the football into the end zone. Now, when a football player running with a football takes that football into the end zone, boom! It's a touchdown." - Anthony DeFeo
Not a quick fix
He likely won’t be ready to go until mid-season, but the best option for NT in the long-term is a veritable Casey Hampton clone and (according to all of the current projections I’m seeing which have him valued somewhere in the 5th round) can be had for our 4th round pick. Josh Chapman from Alabama. Alabama gave up over 100 yards rushing only 3 times: 1) 107 yards at Penn State, roughly half of which came in the 4th quarter when the game was basically over. 2) 148 yards at home to LSU in the regular season matchup, most of which came off of option runs to the outside which is not usually indicative of poor play on the nose. 3) 302 yards at home to Georgia Southern (a very good FCS school, but FCS nonetheless) and Chapman didn’t play that game. Chapman was rated a solid 2nd rounder until he had ACL surgery after the season (mind you he played 7 games WITH the injury). Given that the VAST majority of NTs come out in obvious passing situations, a 4th round pick is MUCH more palatable than the other options I’m seeing discussed, and Chapman is very experienced as a 3-4 NT playing against top caliber competition in the SEC he is a steal.

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