So Much For Youth Movement Along D-Line: Steelers Re-Sign Kirschke

by Michael Bean on Feb 19, 2008 12:54 PM EST in News

The Pittsburgh Steelers and reserve defensive end Travis Kirschke agreed to a two-year contract. Financial terms of the deal, which was announced by Steelers headquarters this morning, have not yet been disclosed.

Kirschke has been a decent special teams player during his tenure in Pittsburgh, which commenced in 2004, but when forced into a starting role, as he was in '07 when All-Pro Aaron Smith was injured, he struggled. The absence of Smith precipitated our steady decline in defensive productivity, especially in the running game.

I'd like to see the terms of the deal before officially saying I'm disappointed and not all that impressed. Put it this way though: Kirschke was unrestricted, and at least on the surface, there was little to no bidding war around the league for his services. Had there been, it's more than likely that the organization would have let him go. He is an 11-year veteran though, so perhaps it's too be expected that most teams aren't interested in acquiring him.

Kirschke earned $1.6 million in 2007, with another $550,000+ counting against the gap. If you look at the Steelers Salary Cap Numbers from '07, you might notice that Kirschke was fairly well paid considering his contributions on the field. Chris Hoke comes to mind as a guy who did more for less ($1.147 cap hit). B-Mac and DeShea also cost less. Even Santonio and Heath earned smaller pay checks. That's about all you need to know.

Stay tuned for the terms of the deal. In the meantime, weigh in on how you perceive the move. On the one hand, Aaron Smith and Big Snack are aging a touch, and there's no guarantee 4th round pick Ryan McBeam from a year ago will be ready to play. On the other hand, the signing doesn't really do anything to make us a better, or younger football team.

Update: Commentors have pointed out that Kirschke probably signed for the league veternan minimum, prompting me to investigate how the system works, and what the worst-paid, but most experienced players in the NFL received:

How does the veteran minimum salary system work?

The system was implemented to make it less costly to retain older veterans at the minimum salary. Under this new system, the Salary Cap count for a player with four or more Credited Seasons who signs a contract will be the same as the count for a player with three Credited Seasons.

The difference between the Salary Cap count for a qualifying contract and the stated minimum for the qualifying player's years of service will be counted as a Player Benefit and as such is not charged against the teams Salary Cap.

For example, in 2003, a veteran player with 5 Credited Seasons will receive a Minimum Salary of $530,000; however, only $450,000 will count against his club's Team Salary. The difference of $80,000 will be counted as a Player Benefit and be paid out of the NFL-wide benefit pool. Similarly, a qualifying player with 12 Credited Seasons will receive a Minimum Salary of $755,000; however, only $450,000 will count against his club's Team Salary. The difference of $305,000 will be counted as a Player Benefit and be paid out of the League-wide benefit pool. As a result, the 10-year veteran making $755,000 will cost the club the same as the three-year veteran making $450,000.

That's correct, MS Paint does suck and instead of learning my new copy of Photohop this moment, I'll instead search for what the minimum is in 2008. I'm guessing it's in the $820-$875 range, meaning Kirschke might be taking a pay-cut, if he is in fact just offered the league minimum. Read above once more to remind yourself that the entire salary base is not counted against the club's cap space however. In essence, Kirschke could be had on the cheap while still earning one or two final paydays before calling it a career. If he can contribute to special teams, teach the younger guys some of the intracicies of the defense, and be available in case of an injury, he may very well be worth the $500-$600 thousand in cap space it might cost to retain him for the next two years.

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Comments

ten bucks

says we signed him for ultra-cheap (probably the veteran minimum) and are keeping him to help teach the Defense to whoever we draft for that spot. while he may not be a stud on the field due to physical limitations he has a ton of experience and i'm sure understands the defense very well.

by TheMostViolentTeam on Feb 19, 2008 1:01 PM EST reply actions

better be on the cheap

I would have lost a ton of money if someone would have bet me on this one a month ago. Anybody know how much the veteran minimum is?

Signing a marginal 33 year player doesn't do much for me and that probably tells us even more what they think of McBean.

"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 19, 2008 1:10 PM EST reply actions

ugh

I second cgolden's opinion. If Kirschke is the new Eason, fine. Sign him, keep him around for camp, and if the new guys can't get it done, he can make the roster. If, on the other hand, he's the #3 DE, we're in trouble.

by BadMaafala on Feb 19, 2008 1:55 PM EST reply actions

Steelers Salary Cap up to par again

From Steelers Salary Cap.com:

Kirschke signed a two-year contract worth $2.28 million, which includes a $300,000 signing bonus. This contract was signed on or around February 19, 2008 as reported by ESPN. (NOTE at this time a guessed at his base salaries. For 2008, I guessed it to be his minimum base salary. This data will be available from the nflpa in several days.)

2008 Cap Value: $980,000
2009 Cap Value: $1,300,000

Not quite the veteran minimum we were hoping for but it was a pay cut and I guess it's okay if he offers some veteran leadership. It's not exactly getting my Terrible Towel waving though.

"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 19, 2008 2:25 PM EST reply actions

yah those numbers

are ok with me....guess we'll see how the salary cap hits work out. at the same time, was Kirschke that terrible?, I had read a couple scouts breakdowns that said a big problem after A. Smith left was Casey Hampton wasn't commanding double teams later in the season either. Previous to Smith's injury this was happening but Smith was SO good he could take on double teams as well occasionally to offset Casey fading as the season went on. obviously Kirschke is a backup level player, and in my opinion he is OK in spot duty, which is what we expect him to do for us anyways.

by TheMostViolentTeam on Feb 19, 2008 2:31 PM EST reply actions

Bird in the hand

Since we have not drafted or signed one additional defensive lineman so far, what sense does it make to to subtract an experienced player. If we corral the desirable talent over the next few months then he can be cut (without guarantees) at any time. Otherwise, we have knowledgeble, competent veteran in place just in case.

by Ivan Cole (RickVa) on Feb 19, 2008 3:12 PM EST reply actions

good points

By RIck and smash.

There really isn't any point in subtracting a body at this point, given what we expect the team to do roughly with their draft picks.

I'm just eagerly awaiting some huge news. Guess this just didn't quite satiate my hunger :)

by Michael Bean on Feb 19, 2008 3:55 PM EST up reply actions

Wait and See

I think that might just be the best approach. If he's a good locker room guy and can provide some knowledge to the youth then it might be an alright play - at least we know what we're getting.

by smashmouthsteel on Feb 19, 2008 3:45 PM EST reply actions

relevance to mcbean

RickVa has nailed it on the head. This is more of a depth chart paper move entering FA and Draft season than a projection of 2008 season depth chart reality. By bringing him to training camp, we might also be able to keep him around and ''available for re-signing'' -- even if he is cut at the end of preseason -- should an emergency situation occur. At his age and status he won't have many alternatives. I'm looking at this strictly as insurance in case the Steelers come up blank in FA and whoever we draft breaks a leg or is a dud.

It would be jumping the gun to suggest this is an indictment of McBean. Yes, maybe he is a dud. He won't be the first second-day draft dud in Colbert's reign of draft error. But he has the basic physical tools and will get every chance to make Kirschke dispensible. Considering Tomlin's post-season comments for the team's need to get younger, bigger and stronger on the lines, the pressure is on McBean (and Colbert) to meet the challenge set down by the head coach. If Kirschke makes the active roster to start the season, then I will get pissed off.

I would like the Steelers to make a pitch for UFA DE Darrion Scott (26 years old, 6-3, 290, a 2004 third-round pick) who played very well in Minny when Tomlin was DC there and could at least share starting time with Keisel. Here is part of a synopsis of his play in 2005-06 from a Vikings analyst:

''Pro Career: In 2005, with an injury to first round pick Kenechi Udeze, (Scott) started fifteen games combined at both end positions. Known as a tackling machine and a run stopping clog on the line Darrion consistently racks up tackles, and for the most part far exceeds his defensive end teammates in that number. Over the last two seasons (2005 and 06) registered 104 tackles and 9.5 sacks ... A large defensive end he was one of the many reasons the Vikings were stout against the run last season and registered 46 tackles (and 5.5 sacks).''

A few negatives on Scott: Udeze's career-threatening illness might cause the Vikings to make a stronger effort to re-sign Scott. Last year he played just four games before breaking a bone in his foot, but up to that point had registered just one tackle in limited playing time. And in December he was arrested on a misdemeanour for pot possession. Not a big deal in my books but perhaps a red flag for others.

by steeler lifer on Feb 19, 2008 8:08 PM EST reply actions

Signing bonus

The signing bonus also seems to follow the Rooneys style of taking care of people. If they do cut him, the cap hit isn't huge, but the signing bonus is enough to keep him going for a while.

by WolfpackSteelersFan on Feb 20, 2008 10:07 AM EST up reply actions

looks solid

and has the size to play 3-4 end. plus versatility to play a 4-3 (as we do go to 4-3 formations occasionally). Tomlin's familiarity with him you'd think he might be on our radar. shouldn't be expensive either.

by TheMostViolentTeam on Feb 19, 2008 8:20 PM EST reply actions

super bowls

lynn swanns catch at 6:40
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13HGHmPHQEI&feature=related
if u want to watch steel curtain check out this guys vids

by bohur on Feb 19, 2008 10:20 PM EST reply actions

mini salary benefit

Just reading along...good stuff.

The minimum salary benefit is correct. The paragraphs you included in your update are
true - alittle dated, but true.

However, one of the main things that has to happen to get the benefit is a ONE-YEAR contract at that player's minimum base salary. In addition, that player cannot receive any other bonuses besides a signing bonus. For 2008, in order to qualify for the benefit, the signing bonus cannot be larger than $40,000.

For example, for Kirschke to have qualified for the benefit, he would have had to sign a ONE-year contract with an $830 K base salary (his minimum...10 or more credited seasons) and no more than a $40,000 signing bonus. If he signed this contract, his salary cap value would be $485,000 (assuming a $40K SB).

by steelersalarycap on Feb 19, 2008 10:57 PM EST reply actions

thanks for the clarification

I was wondering if you were still lurking. I'd love for you to write a cap piece for us. I'll email you at some point to see if you'd be willing.

by Michael Bean on Feb 19, 2008 11:09 PM EST up reply actions

I have a question for CapGuy

Kirschke's salary according to PPG is $830 this year and $1.15 next, with signing bonus of $300. Does that mean that $150 of signing bonus is pro-rated for each of the two years against the cap? Thanks.

by maryrose on Feb 20, 2008 9:07 AM EST up reply actions

yes

That's how is signing bonus is prorated. It's the sum / # of years of contract. $150k cap hit for next two years.

by Michael Bean on Feb 20, 2008 12:16 PM EST up reply actions

The Bird

I agree with RickVA that Travis Kirschke is the bird in the hand. They will be trying to replace him and Eason for 08 but you can only do so much with 6 picks and the FA market that is out there. Kirschke is for depth and in case McBean and a Day 1 draft pick don't pan out. He will probably be cut in camp if they find a DE in the first 3 and McBean is everything positive stated above. If Kirschke is with the Steelers in 08 he probably won't be for the last year of his contract.

THANKS FOR THE LINK BOHUR. That was awesome! I've been watching all the big games of my youth on You Tube for the last 12 hours. Didn't realize they were there. Gotta catch some shut eye!

When You Run The Ball Good Things Happen

by 5020 on Feb 20, 2008 9:52 AM EST reply actions

kirschke

Just to add...

If cut after June 1 (and before opening regular season game), Kirschke would count $150K of dead money in 08 and $150 in 09.

Although I would be surprised to see it happen, this contract does not guarantee him a spot on the 08 roster.

by steelersalarycap on Feb 20, 2008 12:24 PM EST reply actions

question for u cap

Do any contracts guarantee spots on the roster? In writing?

by Michael Bean on Feb 20, 2008 12:33 PM EST up reply actions

nice to know

He'll probably make it through this year but it's nice to know he won't hurt too much if cut.

"You know who I want? William Wallace. That's who I'm looking for" - Bengals defensive line coach when asked who he was looking for in the draft

by cgolden on Feb 20, 2008 12:41 PM EST up reply actions

If CapGuy is still with us..

I sent these questions to some email address but it might not have landed...

What is DEION?
Why when I went to the Salary Cap Sheet did Ben's DEION subtracts from his total cap hit in 2008 and Troy's was added? What gives?
Why is McBean "dead money?" Isn't he on our roster still? Did we cut him? Why isn't he like the others with a $295,000 salary for 2008? Why is his number different?
Is "dead money" guys who have been cut that we need to pay the pro-rated bonus still?
I basically have the Steeler payroll now at $102,500,000 from a $116M cap, giving us about $13.5 for free agents if we want to max out...What is a safe sum to put aside of that $13.5 to pay drafted players?

by maryrose on Feb 20, 2008 3:05 PM EST up reply actions